Kaigelu 316 Fountain Pens

[captpat]

I went to Catholic school for grades 1 through 5, fountain pens were the only authorized writing instrument (except in 1st grade we could use big fat pencils for some subjects). At the time Schaefer fountain pens could be had at the local store for ~$1, including a box of 5 cartridges, and that is what all of us used. When we moved and I started 6th grade that marked my introduction to ballpoint pens. For a pure writing experience, nothing matches a well-tuned fountain pen and it remains my preferred choice today. However, it's hard to beat a rollerball for trouble-free performance in any environment in this case the Uniball 207 is my weapon of choice.

 

[captpat]

Can you describe what's wrong with the pen?

I've done a fair bit of my own nib tuning so hearing about a problem a Nibmeister can't solve is very intriguing.

It's been a while since I used it, if I recall correctly it was a combination of hard starting, skipping, uneven lines, and occasional burping. This is just a simple medium gold nib, and also not inexpensive to replace, which I would have done had it been steel. I suspect there may be other issues with the pen affecting ink flow that make fixing it problematic. Now that I think about it I'm not sure where that pen is.

 

[Hillcrest]

Actually that's the opposite of how you avoid burping.

My favorite style of piston filler has a separate cap over the filling knob, which means you can regularly push all of the air out of the piston while using the pen (and I love writing with a saturated feed).
They're very rare but if you have a pen in this configuration then it's much easier to avoid burping because you don't have to go through the hassle of re-filling the pen just to alleviate worry of pressure differential (e.g. flying, or even just driving cross state).

This is technically another advantage of the cartridge/converter design over the average piston filler.

On my pens I just fill it all the way ... no air ,,, and write away. The only leaks I've had ... on chinese oens came from the imperfect seal around the nib unit, Those pens had a cellophane seal on both sides of the inner nib unit inside the housing ... I cleaned and dried them then used some nail polish to re-seal. Ive never had a problem since. This happened on one Junhao x-450 and one other. The beauty of those pens is you can switch the nibs out for better nibs. I'm currently using an x-450 with a Sengbusch 17 nib. Its as close as I'll ever get to the Mont Blanc Calligraphy pen and only cost $3.00. My x-750 all came with architect/hebrew nibs which is the grind I prefer. My other current pen is an older Pelican M-200 with semi-flex nib ... since replacing the broken piston I fill it as an eyedropper. I switched my hobby from pens to pipes so I am a bit out of touch on the pen hobby.

 

[Briar Lee]

Could somebody better schooled on fountain pens share with me the reason the Parker 51 had a shielded nib?

Look at these $9 “Hero” pens that more or less copy the Parker 51.

 

[Hillcrest]

View attachment 255039View attachment 255040Could somebody better schooled on fountain pens share with me the reason the Parker 51 had a shielded nib?

Look at these $9 “Hero” pens that more or less copy the Parker 51.

View attachment 255038

I'm pretty sure that is a Parker 61 with the embedded arrow. The hero 616S is an homage to the 51 and 61 but the nib tipping can break off after some time rendering it useless. Its basically a disposable once it breaks. You should be able to get 6 months to a year of general use out of it though. Kenneth Parker had a passion for aircraft aerodynamics and the pen was designed to reflect that ... the advertisements compared it to the P51 Spitfire in a downward flight. You could also google Parkerpenpenography for a site that details every parker pen for collectors.

There are plenty of histories and a few youtube videos.

The Grey Parker 51’47

The Parker “51” is one of the most successful pens ever produced. This one I came to possess more by accident than by design. Much to my surprise, no one else shared my interest in this pen includi…

fountainpenchronicles.blog

The Parker 51 Fountain pen — Rust Magazine

The Parker 51 is one of the all time great fountain pens. It was also one of the most commercially successful pens ever made. It was the choice many historic figures in the 20th century.

www.rustmag.com

 

[RonB]

In addition to the sleek look, the Parker 51 hooded nib also keeps the nib from drying out as soon.

 

[Briar Lee]

Thanks for the information. The hooded nib was for style and to shield the nib from drying out (or also dribbling ink.)

And Parker 51 pens were made of polished Lucite.

That leads me to a another question.

My fake Mont Blancs and my real ones both have the same polished plastic resin barrels and caps. To tell the difference you must look at other design details.

But I own a Pelikan Celebry and a custom Grifon’s and an old Cross Townsed that are made with a sort of tortoise shell hard lacquered finish that is just beautiful and luxurious beyond words.

My multi hued Chinese resin pens are beautiful but they don’t even start to match a true high dollar pen with a lacquer finish and don’t attempt to.

How dey do dat?

 

[bullet08]

Okay, I understand. You love cheap Chinese stuff. I really do understand. I love cheap stuff too. But you don't have to brag about it!

 

[frozenchurchwarden]

It's been a while since I used it, if I recall correctly it was a combination of hard starting, skipping, uneven lines, and occasional burping. This is just a simple medium gold nib, and also not inexpensive to replace, which I would have done had it been steel. I suspect there may be other issues with the pen affecting ink flow that make fixing it problematic. Now that I think about it I'm not sure where that pen is.

The only problem I've seen that's nearly impossible to fix is a spiral twisted nib tine.
Normally it's easy to correctly space, straighten and polish the tines but if one of them is twisted it defeats every usual method of tuning a nib.
Sadly it's a lot more common than you'd think, one time I bought half a dozen Pelikan steel nibs just to check consistency and OH BOY they are not consistent.
From what I can tell quality control from European nib makers is almost non-existent.
I have to assume it's one of those cases where the idea of checking each nib properly is just way more expensive than selling everything and letting the customer sort out what's good or bad.
Point is anyone who buys a pen and isn't happy with the writing quality should feel no shame in sending a pen back to the company multiple times.

Meanwhile Japanese companies can mass produce steel nibs for pennies a piece with much greater consistency than most of the fancy high end nibs out of Europe.

 

[frozenchurchwarden]

On my pens I just fill it all the way ... no air ,,, and write away. The only leaks I've had ... on chinese oens came from the imperfect seal around the nib unit, Those pens had a cellophane seal on both sides of the inner nib unit inside the housing ... I cleaned and dried them then used some nail polish to re-seal. Ive never had a problem since. This happened on one Junhao x-450 and one other. The beauty of those pens is you can switch the nibs out for better nibs. I'm currently using an x-450 with a Sengbusch 17 nib. Its as close as I'll ever get to the Mont Blanc Calligraphy pen and only cost $3.00. My x-750 all came with architect/hebrew nibs which is the grind I prefer. My other current pen is an older Pelican M-200 with semi-flex nib ... since replacing the broken piston I fill it as an eyedropper. I switched my hobby from pens to pipes so I am a bit out of touch on the pen hobby.

My Jinhao Dragon pen is one of the best fountain pen surprises, it's only an ordinary medium nib but it was almost as excellent as my best tuned nibs right out of the box (I'm sure there is some element of luck there but it proves the point as well as anything, the price of the pen rarely impacts the writing quality).

I have a 159 with a swapped nib somewhere, but I seem to remember having carved out the feed to try and keep up with a 1.5mm stub and it drools a bit now.

... However, it's hard to beat a rollerball for trouble-free performance in any environment in this case the Uniball 207 is my weapon of choice.

History certainly twists and turns.
Throughout college I searched the stationary stores for any pen that could write consistently, I was even willing to buy the fancy pressurized Fisher Space Pen cartridges but those turn out to have a short shelf life and even less consistency than your average ballpoint.
Every few months I would take my desk mug full of "failed" ballpoint pens and in a righteous anger snap them in half one by one.
I spent at least one entire year of college using nothing but fine tip felt pens because ball point pens are so infuriating.

Naturally I did eventually find the famous Pilot G2 (the only ballpoint pen I have ever been satisfied with), but guess what else Pilot is famous for?



This isn't the pen that started my FP addiction but it is my #1 favorite pen ever since I held it.
The Custom 742 in Music nib, the best behaved stub nib you'll ever find, wet but never drooling, and the barrel houses the Pilot Con-70, a capacious 1ml cartridge/converter with a vacuum pump filler (I can't say I prefer it to a piston type but the large capacity more than compensates).

This pen writes so well it convinced me to give up on chasing flex nibs forever.
(None of the modern flex nibs write like a proper wet noodle and vintage pens inevitably come with their own gremlins.)

 

[Briar Lee]

I’ve answered my own question about the plastics used to make fancy pens.

The classic Mont Blanc was (and still is) made of a proprietary “precious resin” that is easily copied modern poly. They are never lacquered. The chemical formula is methyl methacrylate (Lucite, Perspex, Plexiglass)

Poly(methyl methacrylate) - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

The flashy, gorgeous tortoiseshell pen barrels that are highly lacquered and look a mile deep probably were celluloid but are now vinyl acetate.

Vinyl acetate - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

The Pilot G-2 gel rollerball is the standard now, by which all other pens are judged.

Whether it’s a poly or fake celluloid pen the roller ball version will duplicate these:



Your fancy pen is just some kind of upscale version of a clear poly Pilot G-2 that sells for $1.50 each with an extra refill.

And the Pilot G-2s sold in the USA are likely also made here.

As my old buddy Jack used to say, you have to get up awfully early in the morning to get ahead of the United States of America.

 

[Briar Lee]

So now I have metal pens, poly acrylic pens, fake celluloid tortoise shell pens, and for $13 delivered I just bought a pen with a fake (??? in China it might be real celluloid) celluloid tortoiseshell cap and a checkerboard barrel.



In the USA real celluloid has been outlawed since the late forties, due to the extreme flammability of the material.

In China they still make it, but the modern synthetic replacement is likely cheaper, and many times less likely to burn down the factory making it.

But help me understand how the pen makers came up with precise geometric checkerboard barrels and gorgeous tortoiseshell patterns a century ago using celluloid.

There’s a machine over in China spitting these things out like watermelon seeds.

How dey do dat?

 

[Hillcrest]

I'm sure there is some element of luck there

not really ... IIRC ... Jinhao is a division of Shanghai Stationary Company ... one of oldest pen maufacturers in China ... Where there are "B"illions of fountain pen users.

I have bought Pilot G-2s but they stop writing on me about halfway for some reason or they "railroad track"

Best ballpoint I ever wrote with and still have some was the Uniball powertank...and the cartridge lasted over a year on average.
I use a fountain pen privately but have cheap ballpens for others to use ... (Currently Z-grip ballpens) ... I would only let an experienced fountain pen user try my fountains as most people suddenly develop the urge to carve their initials into wood tables and desks !! #$%^&* !

 

[Briar Lee]

I thought celluloid was pretty well a thing of the past and once again, I was wrong.

Good pens are still made of real celluloid.

And yes, it’s flammable.

My really nice Grifon’s and Pelikan and old Cross Townsed are genuine celluloid. The luminescence and sheen of the real stuff can’t easily be duplicated.

Let’s see if my checkerboard and tortoise shell $13 Chinese pen has that same high dollar glow.

 

[Briar Lee]

I dug out my two genuine Mont Blanc fountain pens and even with a loupe, the only way to know my modern fake rollerball is a fake is there’s no serial number and should be.

The oldest one I got in 1983, and it shows wear:



The other one was a present from my mother about 1993. It has a serial number and a few changes. She bought it from the Charley Rich looking guy who sold lots of meerschaum pipes in Springfield who said her son needed a matched pair. Post 1991 pens have serial numbers and slightly different details.

 

[captpat]

As I read this thread I was struck by how much fountain pen use and pipe smoking have in common. Pens play the role of pipes, and ink the role of tobacco. These are only the first and most obvious of a number of other similarities. Importantly the future of both is not a given. Pipe smoking remains under continuing regulatory and tax assaults; cursive writing is no longer taught in most schools, experts predict a future where we communicate with emojis instead of hand-printed or computer-generated words. Luckily I'm well stocked to enjoy both hobbies before either transition to the fate of buggy whips.

 

[Hillcrest]

... Importantly the future of both is not a given. Pipe smoking remains under continuing regulatory and tax assaults; cursive writing is no longer taught in most schools, experts predict a future where we communicate with emojis instead of hand-printed or computer-generated words. Luckily I'm well stocked to enjoy both hobbies before either transition to the fate of buggy whips.

 

[Briar Lee]

The Pelikan Celebry, the Grifon’s sterling silver, and my old Cross Townsed have a certain high dollar sheen and luminescence that only a fine pen grade of real celluloid can have. They aren’t resin or poly acrylic.

 

[Briar Lee]

I took some lighter fluid and cleaned up my 1983 Mont Blanc and it took an international standard Monteverde cartridge. These were excellent pens, but so are the counterfeits. The real ones have either solid or heavy gold filled clips and bands that don’t “brass” after heavy wear.



The one Charlie Rich’s long lost brother sold Mama ten years later has a few subtle changes. In 1993 they were serial numbered, used a wine final on a wine pen instead of a black final, and didn’t plate the entire nib. By 1993 I’d parked my first one and the second one is like new yet.







Never buy a used Mont Blanc, without knowing who sold it.

The modern counterfeits are extremely good. This one cost under $25 and even has a serial number. I can’t see the slightest difference between the post 1991 pen my mother gave me and the new fake rollerball. Buyer beware.

 

[Briar Lee]

Ranking in order, my best pen is a sterling silver Grifos from Italy.

Grifos of Italy makes limited series production of pens, and this one is a couple of years old made when Covid was hurting luxury goods so badly Grifos was selling $300 pens for half price, engraved. I wish I’d bought more.

Grifos uses a guilloche barrel and cap machine they brag was from the depression era Parker Company. They are hallmarked, and the entire pen is sterling silver except a sterling plated spring steel clip and the utterly gorgeous celluloid barrel that looks ten miles deep.


This is just insane qualty. It will last centuries, if the celluloid doesn’t rot or get too close to a flame.