How Many Blends are There *Really*

[JD Buckeye]

On the marketing question, I have no way of knowing, but as @woodsroad mentioned Fusilier's and Bengal were the same (I still remember tasting them back and forth, trying to figure out the difference, before I learned about this), and I fully expect that plenty of that is going on across the board.

One other variable that I only recently suspected is that in much rarer cases, one tobacco might be the aged version of another. Specifically this came to mind when I recently started smoking Edisto. I can't prove this and may well be wrong, but it tastes to me like CRF when fresh.
For all that I know, CRF may just be 5-6 YO Edisto.

Anyway, like many others, I find that latakia overwhelms most else and so winds up equalizing most blends that it's dominant in. There are exceptions. Quiet Nights is distinct, as is Penzance. Peretti Omega stands out to me as at least higher quality than most. And there are others. But for run of the mill latakia mixtures, the flavor is more or less latakia.

It didn't used to be that way. When I first started, all the English blends seemed distinct. But once my palate transitioned to VA nuance, it would ever-after be overwhelmed by latakia in a way that flattened the distinction of the other components (usually).

This very well might be the case. There is the added labor of pressing a mixture, tinning, etc. D&S, Capt. Earle's, GLP may indeed require those matured/finer/higher quality/rarer leaves and justify the uptick in price.

 

[Zamora]

I used to think the same thing. Then I participated in the Latakia challenge on here. GLP Renaissance and SG Squadron Leader showed me I was wrong!

I've always thought they had a lot of variety, of course the first two tinned ones I got were Presbyterian and Plum Pudding. Sutliff Medium English was the first ever,, one of my local shops sells it but I didn't bother stocking up because it's pretty generic tasting and the shop mostly sells cigars so it's not selling out anytime soon.

 

[Zamora]

From my brief stint on the periphery of pipe tobacco marketing, I can tell you, unequivocally, that there are many duplicate blends out there, the same product in different packaging. But how many people have actually (correctly) call them out? What that shows is that most people don’t notice it. Even a blend as distinctive as Fusiliers Ration went unnoticed when STG rebranded is as Bengal Slices, but continued selling it under both labels. So, what difference does it make when pipe smokers are so easily fooled and completely distracted by a name or label? My answer is that it matters not a bit. Smoke what you like, enjoy the label.

And apparently Creme Brulee is just bulk Molto Dolce

 

[DanWil84]

I do love me some IPAs

So do I, but I sometimes get tired of the same same most brewers want a IPA to be. I have had about 800 unique beers ans sometimes I just want to drink beer. I wouldnt be surprised I come to a point that I drink readily available belgian dubbel, tripel or quad and be content with it. Same with tabacco, I wouldnt be surprised when Im further in my "voyage" after a few more years I would smoke 3 or 4 blends in under total 10 pipes and be happy.

 

[Chasing Embers]

And apparently Creme Brulee is just bulk Molto Dolce

Yep.

Many if not all of their tins were renamed bulk blends.

 

[JD Buckeye]

So do I, but I sometimes get tired of the same same most brewers want a IPA to be. I have had about 800 unique beers ans sometimes I just want to drink beer. I wouldnt be surprised I come to a point that I drink readily available belgian dubbel, tripel or quad and be content with it. Same with tabacco, I wouldnt be surprised when Im further in my "voyage" after a few more years I would smoke 3 or 4 blends in under total 10 pipes and be happy.

Beer is the one thing I narrow down quite quickly on what I like. I try other ones but have my one favorite. Luckily it's a Columbus brewing offering.

Tobacco, I suspect will be like coffee...I'll be on the quest seemingly forever

 

[justscience]

Limited editions, especially in numbered tins automatically taste unique and better in inverse proportion to their availability. Unique! Superior! I got mine!! Get yours off Tinbids next week, losers. HA!

 

[woodsroad]

Its your problem that you cant taste the difference between the exquisite orientals fertilized with Istanbulian stray cat poo from the left side of plot 123456 and the ones not fertilized with same cat poo, dang it!

All jokes aside, from the limited experience I have with smoking in general and englishes in specific, I can tell the difference. Admittingly, one is Presbyterian where the sour notes of the orientals (either with or without cat poo) is prominent to me and Latakia is on the background, another one is a SG Shag blend with a vanilla aroma (forgot the name) where the vanilla is offsetting the Latakia very well. Yet another is C&D Star of the East Flake which is 50% Latakia and the other components are much more in the background. I like them all for their differences. Would I be able to tell one or another from all of them, offcourse not. And like said, some blends in a portfolio might be the same in another can, but thats happening all over the board with marketing.

I could call myself a beer geek and im convinced for a lot of beers, especially with IPA and barrel aged beers, its common to brew the same base beer and when fermenting make minor tweaks in hop profile which are not noticeable as most are brewing a high Beta acid hops on the cold side for them fruity flavors. But hey I can still market it as the next best thing as it has a different recipe. Or when putting a fermented beer in a barrel you in some cases wont be able to detect if it is casked in bourbon barrel A or B from distillery X or Y, its about the same. But it sounds interesting that the beer was barrel aged in a barrel from some non obtanium distillery.

Beleive it or not, I bought 2oz of Star of the East for the first time last year. It was my car blend for several months. I was captivated by the balance of the constituent leaves. The Latakia did not overpower the Virginias or Orientals. I suspect that the ratios are similar to my late great Smyrna.

As for beer, the unfermented wort picks up it’s real flavors after the kettle. The mash and boil determine gravity, mouthfeel and bitterness. Post kettle dry hopping, yeast choice, fermentation time and temperature and cellaring choices all have the major impact on the final flavor profile.

 

[Zamora]

I agree that a boat load of english blends are repeats. There are some that are more complex than others. Also a few stand out so its not fair to lump them all in one pile.

Ive not come even close to scratching the surface but I found that GLP Quiet Nights has a unique profile. HU Tuarekh is a good cheaper substitute in the Europe but QN is more intense.

Most of the rest Ive tried, about a dozen, tend to fall in the same pile. I like them but not enough to place them on order. When one jar I opened gets smoked I will move on to the other.

Im not trying to knock C&D but there are business models that rely on constanly adding new product. They certainly have a stable core of blends but there is money to be made from NEW AND IMPROVED! No offense really intended, I hope they make money and stay in business but their catalogue is daunting to say the least.

The C&D business model is very much one that couldn't exist without online sales. If it was all B&Ms they'd be far more mindful about shelf space

 

[Zamora]

Yep.

Many if not all of their tins were renamed bulk blends.

Shit like that drives me crazy, I'm all for having blends available in tin / pouch and bulk but I think there should be transparency like C&D does with that.

 

[Chasing Embers]

Shit like that drives me crazy, I'm all for having blends available in tin / pouch and bulk but I think there should be transparency like C&D does with that.

C&D once renamed Oriental Silk as Oriental Blend Number 1 for a limited pipe show tin.

 

[JD Buckeye]

C&D once renamed Oriental Silk as Oriental Blend Number 1 for a limited pipe show tin.

I doubt I'd be as skeptical if the newest launch as a budget brand wasn't an uptick in price. It's still cheap but it makes me wonder how far up the line it goes

 

[Zamora]

C&D once renamed Oriental Silk as Oriental Blend Number 1 for a limited pipe show tin.

Oh I didn't know about that, I just know they have a ton of stuff under tin and bulk in the same name

 

[Chasing Embers]

I doubt I'd be as skeptical if the newest launch as a budget brand wasn't an uptick in price. It's still cheap but it makes me wonder how far up the line it goes

Many of their bulk prices have doubled in the past 10 years.

 

[DanWil84]

Beleive it or not, I bought 2oz of Star of the East for the first time last year. It was my car blend for several months. I was captivated by the balance of the constituent leaves. The Latakia did not overpower the Virginias or Orientals. I suspect that the ratios are similar to my late great Smyrna.

As for beer, the unfermented wort picks up it’s real flavors after the kettle. The mash and boil determine gravity, mouthfeel and bitterness. Post kettle dry hopping, yeast choice, fermentation time and temperature and cellaring choices all have the major impact on the final flavor profile.

I believe it very much, love that stuff! And its available in the EU as K&K makes some C&D blends for the EU and SOTE is one of them. Unfortunately at a hefty price of 440 a kilo....

I know the true flavors are made in the fermenter, but the whole "this is the next best thing" marketing gets a bit old while its just a minor tweak in hopamount or hop variety used. Even yeast isnt a very big factor for most, if not mentioned brewers mostly use their house strain which they can grow again from the yeast cake on the bottom of the fermenter or the slurry the tap now and then from the fermenter.

 

[sablebrush52]

The answer is 42.

 

[frozenchurchwarden]

Some simple math says the answer is "Yes".

Just the basic blending ratios between four primary tobacco types in 1/8th portions gives 8x8x8x8=4096 potential distinct blends, not including the cut or any special processing of a given leaf before blending, and in reality we have dozens of base varieties to blend with.

 

[Richmond B. Funkenhouser]

Things that are similar taste the same to me... I've always suspected there are "duplicate blends"... Turns out there are.

To me there's barely a difference between ranch and mayo. No difference in Fruity Pebbles and Fruit Loops.

English blends taste like latakia.

Funny thing is... I think my taste buds are shot out from smoking. That means I aint the only one who can't taste for shit.

 

[JD Buckeye]

Some simple math says the answer is "Yes".

Just the basic blending ratios between four primary tobacco types in 1/8th portions gives 8x8x8x8=4096 potential distinct blends, not including the cut or any special processing of a given leaf before blending, and in reality we have dozens of base varieties to blend with.

The math suggests "potentially yes"

 

[eyjaygaming]

fda.gov/tobacco lists 1,599 pipe tobacco blends. These also may include RYO/Pipe tobacco hybrid blends that people use for cigarettes.

There are 14 companies registered with the FDA that produce and/or sell pipe tobacco in the US:

Alliance One Specialty Products, LLC

Davidoff of Geneva USA, Inc.

Friedman-Klinge Cigar Co.

Gawith Hoggarth & Co., Ltd.

Hot Skull Inc.

Inter-Continental Trading USA, Inc.

John Middleton Co.

Kretek International Inc.

Laudisi Enterprises Inc.

Monjure International USA

Scandinavian Tobacco Group Lane Holding Inc.

Sutliff Tobacco Company LLC

Top Tobacco LP

US Flue-Cured Tobacco Growers, Inc.