How have you guys handled insurance?
- Thread starter PiperCalvinist
- Start date
Certainly. I know people that insist their horrible smokers cough is normal and that cigs don't do any harm. Though still love one doctor who survived a plane crash back in the day and refused to quit because in his case it already lengthened his life span because everyone in the smoking section of the plane lived everyone else died.
And there are several types of lung cancer that can be caused by issues with working on a farm. Most of it about dust and dander or chemical exposure.
I do enjoy all the smokers and their exercising here. Lotta of work trying to ameliorate the hazards of smoking. Why not simply accept your choice and enjoy it. We all hope to avoid the down side but face facts, accept the risk many of us will over-tax our immune systems and suffer a bit later in life. Just accept the various downsides, push them to the rear of your mind and enjoy yourselves. Are you shortening your life? Possibly. Risking your quality of life as you age? Possibly. But we're risk takers! Just fill a bowl and enjoy. If you keep trying to justify/validate your choice you'll not enjoy the wee vice near as much.
I'm in my 79th year, at Stage C with heart disease and plodding along beating the odds everyday ... Hopefully most of you will also. Trust your genes guys it's really all we can do.
I'm in my 79th year, at Stage C with heart disease and plodding along beating the odds everyday ... Hopefully most of you will also. Trust your genes guys it's really all we can do.
Anyone who thinks differently has obviously never had to deal with the system or depend on insurance to foot the bill. Schemes designed to cover medical costs where the company that covers the costs gets rich at the same time simply goes beyond any logic. Insurance companies make money by not paying. Simple as that. Health care funded by such institutions does not create an efficiency that works in the patients favor. Oh, it creates efficiencies - the type that only capitalism can effectively make happen.
If you live in the U.S. under our current health care system, you could mark no but add nicotine addiction as a pre-existing condition. In some states if you check that you are a tobacco user insurance companies are allowed to charge up to 50% higher premiums. However nicotine addiction is considered a pre-existing condition, especially in the context of health insurance, as it is a chronic condition that may require ongoing treatment. Under the Affordable Care Act, insurers cannot deny coverage or charge higher rates due to pre-existing conditions like nicotine dependence.
Another of those generalizat6ion based only on personal experience. I paid less that $2000,99 out of pocket for a year if cancer treatments. Blue Cross with some Medicaid has quickly all hospital and doctor bills over the past six years. I pay a buck per prescription for an array of medications. I know there are folks with very different experiences. I simply take exception to "blanket" statements condemning an entire industries.
Before embracing all of Europe's various collective medical care systems investigate Ireland and UK wait times, on a stretcher, often times outside in the weather. I can only report what various overseas friends report to me. I will admit to superb care in a Russian hospital but, I was being hosted by Oblast government, as it were. I received the care a party member would have and not that of a non-member.
No, not from personal experience - That would be a generalization about my comment from you. As an employee of the Palm Springs Unified School District, I served on the district committee that selected and oversaw health insurance for the district. We used hard data provided by a third party to determine our decisions as to what products and companies to offer employees. Our committee was staffed with HR employees who oversaw the healthcare from the district end and they also provided hard data as well to committee members. It was a jarring look into a broken system that was littered with landmines designed to circumvent success from the perspective of the user - that being the district employee. Our role on the committee was to understand the issues and do our best to find ways to ensure the best success for our employees. It wasn't easy.
Secondly, I didn't suggest embracing an European system. In fact, I don't endorse any system as I am skeptical that an effective one is out there - although perhaps one is and I just don't know about it. I do think a for profit system is doomed. If I was to speak about personal experiences, mine, my wife's, my father's, and my late mother's experiences would validate my professional experiences. Blanket statements condemning an entire industry - yes, that would be me - and millions and millions of others as well. I feel like I am in good company with that. What I won't be doing is hunting down an executive. We probably have agreement on that. I am happy to hear you had a positive experience. That is a good thing.
I'm not a moral or ethical person when it comes to billion dollar corporations who would fleece me in a heartbeat.
Indeed, I was remiss in not making that clear.
I must say, you folks took your charge seriously. Good on you. Too bad you you couldn't find a great provider as my representatives did. Great coverage, little conflict so I have no complaints. I must point that the Police and Fire Employees Association wasn't constrained by our municipal government, they simply made payments as only have a minority on the board. The members, through the board, controlled the funds and made the decisions. Very simply we, the members, decided on the investment bankers and closely monitored investments. A couple of times we've far out performed the NYSE resulting in lump sum dispersals to the city and each member. I think retirement plans and investments should always be controlled by those most concerned and not the elected politicians. We had to fight the administration on the plan and finally took the plan to the voters who overwhelming approved the ordinance. So my coverage is guaranteed by law. Lucky me!
The police employees union bargained the plan away so the membership is shrinking through deaths, even as the fund grows. I suspect, if I live a couple more years, I'll get another windfall unless the market tanks. The current crop of coppers has no defined benefits as their union followed the national trend and now all the members have is their investing acumen with the muni providing matching funds, all severely limited. Plus, what young man/woman even considers retirement needs while in their 20's.
This is a great, interesting question.
And I have my principles, that I will PROUDLY share lmao... but this one I come to purely pragmatically. I'm a 32yo male. In (relatively) good health even though I work harder and party hardest (starting to invert those 2 these days since I hit the big 3-0 and picked up a good steady girl, of course lol).
I help run a (high stress) family business. My health insurance is a private policy that I manage, but the business (basically 50% me at this point) pays for. I registered as "smoker" when I got the policy about 5 years ago. It effectively doubles the rate. Back then I was averaging a pack a month, a pipe/cigar a week, vaping in-between. Now, a pack a year, a couple pipes/cigars a month, and vaping sometimes all day long sometimes not for months (never got physically addicted to nicotine thank God, but don't worry, he found other ways to spite me lol)
Do I probably meet the "legal federal blah blah" definition of a non-smoker most average days of the year, absolutely. Is my family history of lung disease (considering I'm barely 3 generations away from all anthracite miners) decent? Yes.
Am I gonna gamble getting into a random car wreck/cancer diagnoses one day after a night out with the boys craving the random cig and having them draw blood and my entire half-million $ claim denied/brought up on fraud because I tried to save our company annually what amounts to a rounding error on one of the smaller jobs we bid? Especially in a world where these sharks are looking for ANY reason to do so? Hell. Fackin. No. Lol
And I have my principles, that I will PROUDLY share lmao... but this one I come to purely pragmatically. I'm a 32yo male. In (relatively) good health even though I work harder and party hardest (starting to invert those 2 these days since I hit the big 3-0 and picked up a good steady girl, of course lol).
I help run a (high stress) family business. My health insurance is a private policy that I manage, but the business (basically 50% me at this point) pays for. I registered as "smoker" when I got the policy about 5 years ago. It effectively doubles the rate. Back then I was averaging a pack a month, a pipe/cigar a week, vaping in-between. Now, a pack a year, a couple pipes/cigars a month, and vaping sometimes all day long sometimes not for months (never got physically addicted to nicotine thank God, but don't worry, he found other ways to spite me lol)
Do I probably meet the "legal federal blah blah" definition of a non-smoker most average days of the year, absolutely. Is my family history of lung disease (considering I'm barely 3 generations away from all anthracite miners) decent? Yes.
Am I gonna gamble getting into a random car wreck/cancer diagnoses one day after a night out with the boys craving the random cig and having them draw blood and my entire half-million $ claim denied/brought up on fraud because I tried to save our company annually what amounts to a rounding error on one of the smaller jobs we bid? Especially in a world where these sharks are looking for ANY reason to do so? Hell. Fackin. No. Lol
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Buy a piece of them and enjoy the return on your investment. Those corporations are owned by folks like me through individual investment or plans. Retirement plans, if properly managed are heavily invested in those companies.
BTW, I detest situational ethics. Either you are moral/ethical or you are not. No middle ground. None at all. Nada!
Yeah make sure you’re honest, It’s the right thing to do. Not out of the norm for insurance companies to profile you by your BMI mind you.
Amen brother. I've always said, I believe the point of life isn't to leap across the finish line with the clean glow of youth but to crawl across it with the griseled resolve of experience and joy of knowing you gave it your all and received all you could in kind. As a wise man once sang "And somewhere in the darkness, the gambler he broke even! And in his final words I found an ace that I could keep!"I do enjoy all the smokers and their exercising here. Lotta of work trying to ameliorate the hazards of smoking. Why not simply accept your choice and enjoy it. We all hope to avoid the down side but face facts, accept the risk many of us will over-tax our immune systems and suffer a bit later in life. Just accept the various downsides, push them to the rear of your mind and enjoy yourselves. Are you shortening your life? Possibly. Risking your quality of life as you age? Possibly. But we're risk takers! Just fill a bowl and enjoy. If you keep trying to justify/validate your choice you'll not enjoy the wee vice near as much.
I'm in my 79th year, at Stage C with heart disease and plodding along beating the odds everyday ... Hopefully most of you will also. Trust your genes guys it's really all we can do.
Sounds like you still got a few left up your sleeve
🫡
Why are we in this mess?
From 1913 to 1941, only very high income earners paid income taxes, and they got stomped.
Various charities ran hospitals and doctors charged what their patients could pay.
After Pearl Harbor the rich were zapped with 95% marginal rates on income over a million dollars.
And ordinary workers for the first time had to file tax returns, and pay income taxes.
Here’s the reason we cripple our employers and make them be our health insurance fairies to the tune of 5% of GDP.
In 1943, the government compromised with unions to allow health insurance to not be taxed, instead of a taxable pay raise.
And since we fought WW2 on cost plus ten per cent, their employers added the cost to the war contracts.
Something on the order of one per cent of health care is self pay today.
We can’t even afford new babies to be born out of pocket.
I used to do quite a few medical bankruptcies until the hospitals just started writing the debts off.
We somehow all pay for our health care now, because no individual can afford to pay for much.
We built the most lavishly expensive health care system on the planet by having a third party pay the bills.
And we can’t go back.
No matter how mean and nasty we talk Americans are great, because Americans are good.
Our great grandchildren will look at us, and say why did they tolerate it for so long.
From 1913 to 1941, only very high income earners paid income taxes, and they got stomped.
Various charities ran hospitals and doctors charged what their patients could pay.
After Pearl Harbor the rich were zapped with 95% marginal rates on income over a million dollars.
And ordinary workers for the first time had to file tax returns, and pay income taxes.
Here’s the reason we cripple our employers and make them be our health insurance fairies to the tune of 5% of GDP.
In 1943, the government compromised with unions to allow health insurance to not be taxed, instead of a taxable pay raise.
And since we fought WW2 on cost plus ten per cent, their employers added the cost to the war contracts.
Something on the order of one per cent of health care is self pay today.
We can’t even afford new babies to be born out of pocket.
I used to do quite a few medical bankruptcies until the hospitals just started writing the debts off.
We somehow all pay for our health care now, because no individual can afford to pay for much.
We built the most lavishly expensive health care system on the planet by having a third party pay the bills.
And we can’t go back.
No matter how mean and nasty we talk Americans are great, because Americans are good.
Our great grandchildren will look at us, and say why did they tolerate it for so long.
In short, end of empire, nihilistic end of civilization, central banking, moral corruption and greed... sure the elites take the lionshare but we all have our own sins. I think we're definitely in the "weak men creating hard times" part of the equation.
Corporations are just groups of us. As are armies, governments, charities, etc.
And all of those groups have greedy bastards at the top. I see it in my line of work everyday so checks out.