Habanos

[AJL67]

Just will add none of the increase is duty or taxes. SA Habanos is and had only been at 50% of their production level since cOviD hit, with a Chinese company buying the 49% stake it was decided that Cuban cigars are a luxury goods item and based their new prices on the Hong Kong luxury goods market. Asia has billions of people and they have a lot of disposable income and Cuban cigars are a status symbol to them, and have been for years.

For normal people like me this means i move to pipes and slow smoke my Cubans, to a lot of people i know it makes very little difference as they have massive amounts of cigars both fresh and vintage that they will never be able to smoke in 3 lifetimes, to them their collections just double and tripled in value.

the fact i bought a bunch of boxes of Monte 5s for $107 a box and before they even shipped to me they were going for $252 (same boxes), i just had good timing and didn’t want to play “wait and see”.

A box of CoRos that was $350 5 years ago in now anywhere from $1100 to $1300+ just means I’ll never be able to buy another box of them, life goes on but it was a shock how fast this all happened

 

[Ag®o]

I add the new price list of the Italian importer

 

[onepyrotec]

I smoke 5-10 Havanas a week. For the few boxes that I paid $50+ per cigar, it was because I wanted to, not because I had no other choice. I have enough cigars to last me a year or two, depends on smoking rate. After that, I am done and will only be pipes from that point forward.

 

[pantsBoots]

I smoke 5-10 Havanas a week. For the few boxes that I paid $50+ per cigar, it was because I wanted to, not because I had no other choice. I have enough cigars to last me a year or two, depends on smoking rate. After that, I am done and will only be pipes from that point forward.

If (and that's a big IF) Habanos SA ever gets their shit together and can fill their management and galley rosters again, supply will increase and prices will come back down again (remember: they axed a bunch of classics and raised prices back in the early '00s, only to have to do a massive restructuring for '06 and prices came back down). The caveat is that they need farmers to continue growing tobacco and not switching to less problematic crops.

 

[AJL67]

If (and that's a big IF) Habanos SA ever gets their shit together and can fill their management and galley rosters again, supply will increase and prices will come back down again (remember: they axed a bunch of classics and raised prices back in the early '00s, only to have to do a massive restructuring for '06 and prices came back down). The caveat is that they need farmers to continue growing tobacco and not switching to less problematic crops.

Prices won’t come down with their current partnership with Chinese tobacco, in 2020 on china consumed more Habanos products than the rest of the planet combined, their production is less than 50% since covid hit. They were able to double and in some cases quadruple prices and they are still selling everything as fast as they can roll, add to that the stupid high prices for their regionals, especially Asia with things like year of the rat and year of the tiger, and they have no reason to ever lower prices. I never imagined seeing a fresh CoLa going fit $100 a stick, same amount last year you could grab a gorgeous Cuban Davidoff No.1 from the 80s.

 

[pantsBoots]

Prices won’t come down with their current partnership with Chinese tobacco, in 2020 on china consumed more Habanos products than the rest of the planet combined, their production is less than 50% since covid hit. They were able to double and in some cases quadruple prices and they are still selling everything as fast as they can roll, add to that the stupid high prices for their regionals, especially Asia with things like year of the rat and year of the tiger, and they have no reason to ever lower prices. I never imagined seeing a fresh CoLa going fit $100 a stick, same amount last year you could grab a gorgeous Cuban Davidoff No.1 from the 80s.

Ok. Fast forward 3 or 4 years from now. Have NC brands with premium offerings claimed a significant portion of Habanos customers? If so, would this lead to Habanos correcting just to stay solvent? I bet it will.

There are lots of people tapping out on CC due to pricing. Most of them would continue smoking if they found something of comparable quality, but a common opinion is that most NC are peppery and earthy and maybe leathery if you're lucky, with not much else going on. There are actually a lot of great NC available today, however, with many flying under the radar due to the sheer amount of options.

Habanos is offering less options, not more, and making the dive in to being a luxury product, like Rolex. A good marketing and distribution push from quality NC manufacturers could bring a lasting change to the demand for Habanos. At that point, Habanos could either tuck tail and focus more on volume with a pricing correction downwards, or double down and stick with the paradigm released just a couple months ago.

 

[AJL67]

Ok. Fast forward 3 or 4 years from now. Have NC brands with premium offerings claimed a significant portion of Habanos customers? If so, would this lead to Habanos correcting just to stay solvent? I bet it will.

There are lots of people tapping out on CC due to pricing. Most of them would continue smoking if they found something of comparable quality, but a common opinion is that most NC are peppery and earthy and maybe leathery if you're lucky, with not much else going on. There are actually a lot of great NC available today, however, with many flying under the radar due to the sheer amount of options.

Habanos is offering less options, not more, and making the dive in to being a luxury product, like Rolex. A good marketing and distribution push from quality NC manufacturers could bring a lasting change to the demand for Habanos. At that point, Habanos could either tuck tail and focus more on volume with a pricing correction downwards, or double down and stick with the paradigm released just a couple months ago.

Man of my hard core CC friends are already starting to find NC sticks they enjoy, why would they lower prices, again they have a market of BILLIONS of people in one country alone, add in the EMEA oil rich countries with people that can afford $100 a stick like it's nothing, they have no reason to ever lower prices. They also are, again at 50% capacity on production and are selling them as fast as they can make them, they will sell them in those same countries just as fast with more stock. Habanos isn't a company that needs to be "solvent" it's the cuban government and they are socialists, they pay rollers on average 3 bucks a day, this is why theft and "backdoor" cigars are rampant.

There are three new Cohibas alone coming out soon, one of them has already been priced at $300 dollars PER STICK and the interest in them is through the roof, they aren't worried about if Adam and Joe are willing to spend $600 on a box of Monte 2s because Huy and Lu Long already area. Many of the smaller gray market vendors that we used to rely on are barely getting any Habanos products in anymore, they are focusing on NCs now.

Nothing is going to change or get better for people like us, the ship has sailed but hey I hope you are right, but I don't see and the people I talk to in the industry don't see it changing either, some of them own very large well known LCDH shops and they are sad for us but happy because they are making money hand over fist.

You want cheap Habanos the option in to go to Cuba, the prices are actually still the same in Cubas they were around the rest of the world a month ago, buy what you can't toss in a few boxes over the limit and slip $50 bucks into your passport at customs... works for me.

I was talking to Alex at a herf a couple months ago (sadly through an interpreter) and asked him a bunch of questions about where he say it going and he was not optimistic, then again he never went back to cuba and will be working with other companies on his own line of sticks, which is a shame because i freaking loved his lanceros! I will say meeting him the first time i was a bit fan boy / star struck, but it was comical because he had the Ferrari jacket, the dior belt, the Porsche sunglasses, lol he was all done up in capitalism. I'll have to try to find a pic it was pretty funny

 

[Egg Shen]

Man of my hard core CC friends are already starting to find NC sticks they enjoy, why would they lower prices, again they have a market of BILLIONS of people in one country alone, add in the EMEA oil rich countries with people that can afford $100 a stick like it's nothing, they have no reason to ever lower prices. They also are, again at 50% capacity on production and are selling them as fast as they can make them, they will sell them in those same countries just as fast with more stock. Habanos isn't a company that needs to be "solvent" it's the cuban government and they are socialists, they pay rollers on average 3 bucks a day, this is why theft and "backdoor" cigars are rampant.

There are three new Cohibas alone coming out soon, one of them has already been priced at $300 dollars PER STICK and the interest in them is through the roof, they aren't worried about if Adam and Joe are willing to spend $600 on a box of Monte 2s because Huy and Lu Long already area. Many of the smaller gray market vendors that we used to rely on are barely getting any Habanos products in anymore, they are focusing on NCs now.

Nothing is going to change or get better for people like us, the ship has sailed but hey I hope you are right, but I don't see and the people I talk to in the industry don't see it changing either, some of them own very large well known LCDH shops and they are sad for us but happy because they are making money hand over fist.

You want cheap Habanos the option in to go to Cuba, the prices are actually still the same in Cubas they were around the rest of the world a month ago, buy what you can't toss in a few boxes over the limit and slip $50 bucks into your passport at customs... works for me.

I was talking to Alex at a herf a couple months ago (sadly through an interpreter) and asked him a bunch of questions about where he say it going and he was not optimistic, then again he never went back to cuba and will be working with other companies on his own line of sticks, which is a shame because i freaking loved his lanceros! I will say meeting him the first time i was a bit fan boy / star struck, but it was comical because he had the Ferrari jacket, the dior belt, the Porsche sunglasses, lol he was all done up in capitalism. I'll have to try to find a pic it was pretty funny

Yes, we will need this picture please. I was reading an article from February this year that the Cuban farmers can’t even get the fertilizer they require. I think overall quality is down so I kind of like that these are being sold to sucker dbags who like to flaunt their wealth and think rare is a flavor. Serves them right.

 

[AJL67]

Yes, we will need this picture please. I was reading an article from February this year that the Cuban farmers can’t even get the fertilizer they require. I think overall quality is down so I kind of like that these are being sold to sucker dbags who like to flaunt their wealth and think rare is a flavor. Serves them right.

Didn’t have the hilarious sunglasses on in this pic and you can’t see the belt but the Jacket is on. Great guy. Balla herfs! Just kidding but love my cigar brothers, can’t wait till the next one i can make coming up around October in cali.

 

[Piping Rooster]

Its been a while since I had a Cuban Cohiba (Germany 2009) And I dindnt think they were all that to be honest. Bought a box take to the Stan to smoke there and I ended up trading and giving most of them away. Dominican and Honduran are now equal to if not better imho.

 

[Piping Rooster]

Man of my hard core CC friends are already starting to find NC sticks they enjoy, why would they lower prices, again they have a market of BILLIONS of people in one country alone, add in the EMEA oil rich countries with people that can afford $100 a stick like it's nothing, they have no reason to ever lower prices. They also are, again at 50% capacity on production and are selling them as fast as they can make them, they will sell them in those same countries just as fast with more stock. Habanos isn't a company that needs to be "solvent" it's the cuban government and they are socialists, they pay rollers on average 3 bucks a day, this is why theft and "backdoor" cigars are rampant.

There are three new Cohibas alone coming out soon, one of them has already been priced at $300 dollars PER STICK and the interest in them is through the roof, they aren't worried about if Adam and Joe are willing to spend $600 on a box of Monte 2s because Huy and Lu Long already area. Many of the smaller gray market vendors that we used to rely on are barely getting any Habanos products in anymore, they are focusing on NCs now.

Nothing is going to change or get better for people like us, the ship has sailed but hey I hope you are right, but I don't see and the people I talk to in the industry don't see it changing either, some of them own very large well known LCDH shops and they are sad for us but happy because they are making money hand over fist.

You want cheap Habanos the option in to go to Cuba, the prices are actually still the same in Cubas they were around the rest of the world a month ago, buy what you can't toss in a few boxes over the limit and slip $50 bucks into your passport at customs... works for me.

I was talking to Alex at a herf a couple months ago (sadly through an interpreter) and asked him a bunch of questions about where he say it going and he was not optimistic, then again he never went back to cuba and will be working with other companies on his own line of sticks, which is a shame because i freaking loved his lanceros! I will say meeting him the first time i was a bit fan boy / star struck, but it was comical because he had the Ferrari jacket, the dior belt, the Porsche sunglasses, lol he was all done up in capitalism. I'll have to try to find a pic it was pretty funny

My dad wanted some cohibas so i took some bands of some AF's and put them on the Cohibas and brought them back for him. Wanted to bring more but didnt have enough bands to do them all. I miss Germany! Well 2009 Germany...

 

[jpberg]

I’ve said it before here, but back when I had taste buds, Cubans started to shit the shit the bed in the mid nineties. Both taste and quality dropped significantly.
They couldn’t keep up with the US cigar boom, and certainly can’t supply what the Chicomms are demanding.
The rest of the cigar producing countries caught up years ago, and are improving, there’s no turning back. Cubans are still the status symbol, but cigar smokers (that don’t get their rocks off on Instagram) have moved on.

 

[AJL67]

Depends on what you smoke and enjoy but i suppose blanket statements are good too.

 

[jpberg]

I can’t think of one Cuban that is better or equal now compared to 1990.
I can think of 50 nonCubans.
I know Cubans are still a thing, that’s cool, but they are (blanket statement) good to mediocre at this point, while their prices verge on comedic.
One opinion, I get that.

 

[AJL67]

I can’t think of one Cuban that is better or equal now compared to 1990.
I can think of 50 nonCubans.
I know Cubans are still a thing, that’s cool, but they are (blanket statement) good to mediocre at this point, while their prices verge on comedic.
One opinion, I get that.

Smoke what you like like what you smoke. I’ve had plenty of shitty cigars on both sides of the fence, i have my preferences just like everyone else, Padrons are great cigars, new smokers ask me what to try that’s where i point them, great line, tastes and unmatched quality, would i take one over a 2015 Monte 2 or certain box code RASS, nope. I have plenty of 70s and 80s Montes that are amazing and impeccably aged, some 80s Cuban davidoff that i only smoke with friends or special occasions, I’ve also smoked through several cabs of the little Tat Petite Cazadores, again smoke what you like and like what you smoke.

 

[AlanH]

I have not had one so I do not know what I missing

 

[cfreud]

Thanks for the updates, peeps. In ye olde days, about 10 years ago, I sent for Cubans through vendors and Monte Cristo No. 2s, Partagas Nos. 4 or pyramids and Romeo and Julietta Churchills were (at most) $10-12 per stick. The San Francisco Giants went to the playoffs in 2012 and smoking two RJ Churchills per game helped us win the Series. (That was all me. You're welcome, San Francisco.)

Superstitions aside, Cubans were tasty and a nice treat, but the variety and quality of pipe tobacco just appealed to me more. And now when I read all of the prices of the Cuban cigars, well, HOLY COW. Guess we're done there. (Quality issues and the Chinese entering the market causing poor smokes, aside.)

Whether it's pipes or cigars, I think I've gotten to an age when my BS-o-meter is broken when it comes to Unobtanium tobacco, be they Esoterica, Cubans or whatever is the item du jour. Whether I'm picking up a cigar or pipe, more the latter, it's gotta be easy. There is still a ton of good tobacco out there. $20-50 per cigar for a Cuban or however-much-an-ounce for hard-to-find blends is a bridge too far for me.

 

[warren99]

I was looking today a spain video on youtube wich states that there is a 150% increase in price of habanos. Of course , since they are not available in USA , it does not matter much here. But , what about the people who buy them outside? . It seems that the reason is the very high demand on the Chinese market.

who says they're not available in the USA? There's a pretty sizable black market in most major cities but like anything else, "caveat emptor," since there are also a lot of fakes around.

 

[Markem]

I’m with Adam on the price issue; I don’t think that SA Habanos will compromise on the new pricing model for a long time.

The custom roll market, on the other hand, is reasonably high quality (buyer beware - know your roller) and will likely become the dominant source for the US and Western Europe.

15 - 20 years ago, buying bundles of customs was difficult. Now, that seems to be the standard lot size for purchase for many. Also, it may be just my view, but a lot more customs seem to be making it to the States. Availability is amazing.

As always, smoke what you like and like what you smoke. Tastes vary, else there wouldn’t be so many different cigars out there.

 

[phdaemon]

I have not had one so I do not know what I missing

If you've ever had an OpusX that's aged, then those are very similar to something like a Cohiba Siglo 2, or a Ramon Allones Specially Selected. They have those "stewed fruit" notes whereas the opus generally has a darkfruit / raisin note to it.