Frustrated - Local B&M - Local brand= twice the price in the US

[greezly]

Don't know if it's worth it to say it here , but i needed to share my frustration with you guys.
As a new pipe smoker , i started to look around for spots to buy my needed supply from . I live in Canada and you know already that taxes are crazy here .
After endless searches , i finally came out by a ''cigar shop'' in town and gave it a visit to see what kind of baccy/goods they have . All i found is some Black Captain and Sail ( about 30$ a 50 gr) . Well, said i ,taxes are taxes , and i am not discuss that fact . However , i was curious to see the pipes/accessories selection ( and how much they sell them), they had some Brighams and Petersons. Took note of 5 random Brighams ( model number + price) .
Went back home and browse among forum's sponsors web sites to do a benchmarking....and geez , my Canadian local store is selling Canadian pipes and Canadian accessories ( i.e filters) twice the price found in the US... I just don't get it...and starting to understand why it's the only shop of the kind left in town , more than 5 B&M closed business during the last 4 years .
How could any pipe smoker with a limited income support a Business like that ? Like i don't know...you are free to put whatever price you like,that's the market place law, but come on..some common sense will keep/bring you customers and prevent you from closing business...this is sick....

 

[marmal4de]

Greezly, I'm in Canada too. My advice for you is this; eff the local B&M and exclusively order tobacco from 4noggins and pipes from smokingpipes. You'll never get burned by either of them, speaking from experience.

 

[steyrshrek]

I guess I'm lucky, my local guy in Kitchener is very close to Internet prices, then again he also sells on line he seems to be within $5-$10 on pipes. Has a great selection and lots of tobacco. The business has been around since around 1891.

 

[bubblehead33]

i feel your pain greezly, i live in Canada too and the prices are crazy. i just made and order from smokingpipes.com and it was great. shipping was cheap and quick, prices are low and never got hit with any duty. id recommend them rather than paying the high prices here. i rather support local but it just aint gonna happen anymore! (sorry bout the rant.)

 

[schmitzbitz]

I tend to take a different approach; I buy the majority of my tobacco in the U.S. (other than a couple of select Brigham blends - King St. Anniversary in particular, that stuff is sublime - but I digress); but pay the premium for pipes in Canada. I can usually talk to retailer down a few bucks (unless it's Schefield and Sons), and they usually toss in a few freebies (pipe-cleaners, rests, etc.). I forsee the day when we will no longer be able to purchase tobacco from south of the 49th, and I figure a few bucks is a small price to pay to keep the B&M tobacconists in my neighbourhood...plus I get to handle the pipe before I buy (always a bonus to me, I look at specs, but until I have the briar in my hands, I'm never sure).

 

[bubblehead33]

i agree with you schmitz that they likely will soon crack down on us bring in tobacco from the states but my nearest real B&M is a 2 hr drive from home and a $45 bridge crossing so im gonna be sh*t outta luck. the only places i can purchase now are 45 mins from me and theyre little kiosks at grocery stores like Sobeys or Superstore, pretty small selections. (another rant, sorry)

 

[orionpyoung]

It simply is not fair to compare prices of local B&Ms to online retailers. I have worked in retail for 9 years. In that nine years I have seen the spectrum of grocery operations from local Co-ops and mom n' pops to the biggest of em all Wal-Mart. The first consideration is the difference in overhead costs between your B&M and online retailer. But the biggest cost difference is the angle Wal-mart rules with, quantity! in a local shop you make and receive small orders of tins, while online businesses are buying full pallets! Look at the discounts smokingpipes puts on order of 5, 10 and 25. Those are nice enough as they are, but still represent a shadow of the kind of discounts they get for buying in large quantity. They are passing on some of the labor saving of you buying in case quantities. Another great matter is the turn over rate of your inventory. Large online retailers have a larger volume of product moving to allow them to put upfront money for large purchases, where the little guys put all that money into buying product then they just have to wait till you walk in and buy it before they actually realize a profit on that investment Count up every tin in the store and multiply that by $30 and consider how much money has been invested but not returned profits as it is still sitting on the shelf. My local is nothing more then 8 jars of cheap greasy bulk aromatics, some basket briars and pipe cleaners, all neatly tucked into the corner of a book store. No smoke lounge, no tins and not even estate pipes. Every time I'm in a larger city I look up the closest smoke lounge in town and stroll on over. I usually head straight to the bulk tobacco and see if they have anything that peaks my interest. I'll buy maybe 2 1oz bags of tobacco, a roll of pipe cleaners and if they have them available I try to buy a matchbook (If they have custom matchbooks I try to buy a few extra!). I light up a bowl and leisurely explore there tin selection and estate pipes. I make sure to visit all the unoccupied nooks(If there are any) and settle down in my favorite and dream of the day I can have this luxury within an hours drive from my town.
Not to get on a rolling rant there, but I highly encourage making even a small bit of room in our budget for keeping a small independent retailer going. With the state wide ban in Michigan on smoking in almost all pubic venues illegal, I would gladly pay a premium to sit down in a open social environment.
And just to make sure no one misunderstands me, I shop mostly at smokingpipes.com or ride my bike about 3 hours away to look at a mid size collection of estates. I'm not saying big is bad, by all means purchase as much as you need on-line to support your passion but just don't forget to keep those little shops afloat. Think of the extra money as a membership fee, you are not paying just for the tobacco but also the experience.

 

[markw4mms]

I'm like most people on here and buy the majority of my supplies online. I do however, visit my closest B&M at least once a month when our pipe club meets there, and usually pick up a few items to help him keep going. He's mostly cigars like so many are now, but he is at our clubs request,adding more pipe related stuff, so I figure giving him some of my business is the least I can do.

 

[tokerpipes]

Or you could have the issue Florida has. The 80% tax is what drove the price up here. Just so the B&M can make a little coin they have to pay the 80% tax to get it as we have to pay for it from them on tobacco. They carry very few tins of tobacco.
Pipes on the other hand is hole different animal. They charge what they want on hand carved made pipes like I saw a Whiley with a price of $1000 but after getting to know the owner and showing my interest he said he would drop it 10% over his cost and said around $400. So its really a crap shot on the pipe prices.

 

[auspipe]

Australia has the worst taxes. 50g tin of petersons is $50, and thats about the best tobacco we can get here. otherwise its captain black, borkum riff or amphora.
I order from 4noggins and so far my two orders arrived without duty. I suggest you try them.
Been considering using smokingpipes.com but not heard any aussies who have bought from them before. duty is $450 a kg if caught.

 

[superbob]

I live in Victoria and yes, tobacco prices suck here too. Pipe prices aren't so bad though.
The majority of my tobacco comes from the US (both e-tailers and B&Ms) but I also make a point to support my local B&Ms. Without them, we wouldn't have a local voice for tobacco. Yes it sucks to buy a $30 tin every so often but I know that they'll be there to introduce pipes and tobacco to a potential brother of the briar.

 

[steyrshrek]

I think it's important to support B&M stores, but not at any cost. I do expect to pay a little more for the convince and hopefully good service, the key word a little more. Unfortunately many stores provide neither and still want to charge a premium for their wares. This is very true in regards to smoking shops which have, in many cases become variety stores selling all sorts of crap with no employees that know anything about the smoking products they sell.
Luckily I'm blessed with a tobacconist that is very knowledgable and the business is the oldest tobacco store in Canada. I've been very impressed shopping there, the service is excellent, the proprietor is extremely knowledgable. The whole experience is a total joy, for this I don't mind paying $5-$10 dollars more a pipe ( for the most part if I bought online that wouldn't even cover shipping). To top it off he has a good website and does sell online too.

 

[orionpyoung]

This thread brings up a question, is there any site that tracks the tobacco taxes by locality? That would be interesting to see, but entirely depressing...

 

[greezly]

steyrshrek , could you PM your tobacconist's web site please?

 

[rcstan]

Here's a link with baccy taxes in the US by state ..... granted, from a "Save the Kids" site ( opens as a PDF )
http://www.tobaccofreekids.org/research/factsheets/pdf/0169.pdf
These are the taxes your local B&M is subject to.

 

[orionpyoung]

Wah! I suppose I should feel lucky with the 32% in Michigan, could be worse, could be in Alaska, 75%!

 

[greezly]

You guys are blessed .

 

[jobacco]

I live in Montreal and my only and first tobacco shop was at Blatter and Blatter.

I purchased a 50g bag of their house blend and it came at around 20$, its not cheap but its less than 30$.

They also sells thins but i didnt asked for the price.

But like other said, its good to buy local, especially if you have a place like Blatter here in Montreal that makes pipe for more than 100 years, and its still familly business.

Its the only way to keep the pipe world alive IMO.

 

[schmitzbitz]

For the Canucks (I'm bored, did some research)
Canadian Loose-Cut Tobacco Tax Rates for 2011; calculated per gram
Federal: $0.05785
British Columbia: $0.185

Alberta: $0.20

Saskatchewan: $0.21

Manitoba: $0.215

Ontario: $0.1235

Quebec: $0.1060

New Brunswick: $0.1374

Nova Scotia: $0.20

Prince Edward Island: $0.193

Newfoundland (excluding Labrador): $0.32

Labrador: $0.1060 (to combat smuggling from Quebec)


Canadian Cigar Tobacco Tax Rates for 2011; Calculated per stick
Federal: $0.85
British Columbia: $0.185

Alberta: $0.20

Saskatchewan: $0.21

Manitoba: $0.225

Ontario: $0.1235

Quebec: $0.1060

New Brunswick: $0.1470

Nova Scotia: $0.2152

Prince Edward Island: $0.254

Newfoundland (excluding Labrador): $0.19

Labrador: $0.1060 (to combat smuggling from Quebec)
So, how do these numbers translate in the real world? Well, lets use B.C. as an example...
Manufacturers price for 200g: $7.00

Federal Excise duty: $3.67

Federal Excise tax: $2.13

Provincial Tobacco Tax: $22.00

Profit (6.5 points): $2.26

General Sales Tax (no PST on tobacco in BC)*: $2.59

Total: $39.66
*It should be noted that we are actually paying HST rather than GST at this time, and as such can expect to see a number closer to $5.00

 

[rd02sir]

I too am a Canadian. Buying tobacco locally for me is very rare. Unless I want a specific blend this instant, I'll usually order online.
For my pipes, I try to go the the ONE shops here, but they have little selection, high price tags ($20-$50 more than online, even with shipping included). I'll drop in once in a while to see if they got anything new, an to get small stuff like cleaners or other accessories. They usually sell more cigars, so I'm not too worried they will dissapear anytime soon.
It's really hard to support out own economy when you can pay half or even less for some tobacco.