Finally Got A Barling... Kinda, Sorta - Any Ideas?

[agnosticpipe]

I, like many here are intrigued by older celebrated pipe makers, and Barling's seem to be one of the most desired. I've looked longingly at many over the years, but never found one I liked, or more importantly one I could afford.
So as usual last week, I was cruising ebay, and was looking at Barling's as well as others. I saw a Barling shape that I really quite liked, a pre-transition pipe no less. It had a buy it now price on it of only $348.95. Yeah, only about $300 more than I could afford. But further on down, I came across a John Peel, BB&S Ltd. Made in London England. I believe BB&S stands for Benjamin Barling & Sons. It looked to be the same shape as the other Barling I was looking at! It had a buy it now, or best offer on it, so I made an offer, and got it for $18.65 including shipping. It needed some cleaning naturally, but was overall in decent shape. The John Peel stamping sucks as the John is really faint, but the Peel is heavily stamped, and the shape number is G5, which tells me nothing.
I can't seem to find much info on these pipes, except that they seemed to be Barling seconds. And to confuse matters more, it seems that John Peel pipes were made by other companies besides Barling. I don't even know when they were made, or if they were named after the popular DJ John Peel. At any rate the pipe matches the size of the other Barling, but just a little smaller. Still, a nice graceful looking pot, which is saying something for a pot, and it smokes really, really great! It has a nice slim bit and button which is very comfortable, and has that nice big bowl with thick walls.
So what say you? A real Barling or not, and any idea of when these were made?
The Barling from ebay.

The John Peel BB&S.

 

[Chasing Embers]

That's awfully danged close isn't it? Really like the curve on that stem. Hopefully Jesse can chime in and shed some light.

 

[sablebrush52]

The John Peel pipes were named for the popular English DJ. The G5 is significant as to which English company made the pipe, and I'm thinking Charatan, but I forget which one used the G as a stamping. They were made in the 1970's. I have one, excellent pipe.
If it is a Charatan made pipe, there's still a Barling connection since Williamson-Barling went to work for Charatan after leaving Barling.

 

[gloucesterman]

In case you haven't seen it already here's a old thread on John Peel pipes. Short version, if it has the BB&S marking it was indeed made by Barling. That however is not true for all John Peel pipes. It was apparently a "private label" made by several manufactures over time.
http://pipesmagazine.com/forums/topic/john-peel-pipe-musings

 

[sablebrush52]

Short version, if it has the BB&S marking it was indeed made by Barling.

Correct, though not made in the Barling factories as Imperial shuttered them in 1970. Barling outsourced pipemaking to several British firms before turning the work over to Nording in the mid 1970's.

 

[loneredtree]

It looks very similar to this shape 5276 TVF very old wood

 

[gloucesterman]

Jesse, As always the devil is in the details. Just for my own edification, Is there a significant quality difference in these later pipes? And if so how would you classify the difference?

 

[sablebrush52]

And if so how would you classify the difference?

So what's different? Shapes, quality of the material used to make the stems, sometimes the draw is more restricted. Obviously the method of choosing and seasoning the wood is different. There will be fills and flaws. That doesn't necessarily translate to worse performance, except with the stems. A cheap molded stem won't give the same smoothness to the draw, nor spread out the smoke as well, since slots on pre-molded stems tend not to be as wide. And the cheaper grades of vulcanite don't feel as comfortable.
People have said that the later pipes just didn't smoke like Barlings, whatever that meant to them. There is a character to a Barling pipe that I can't logically define, but which I have experienced, a kind of perfectly effortless draw without the larger airway diameter, great balance in the hand, neutrality in the wood that lets the flavors of the tobacco shine, and a very comfortable stem and bit, for me, more comfortable than the competition. Much of that holds true for the pipes made in the factory after the family left, mid 1962 thru 1970. But the quality did decline.
All that said, really excellent pipes continued to be made under the Barling banner. One of my favorite Barlings is a "Presentation" grade pipe from the 1970's. It's hand carved, though I don't like the shaping as much as earlier pipes, yet the pipe is comfortable in the hand, well balanced with a nicely made and very comfortable hand cut stem. Great draw, smokes very well, just differently from the earlier product. Maybe another "presentation" grade would give me the same experience as the early pipes. Point is, great pipes were made in all eras.

 

[gloucesterman]

Thanks Jesse, So many of the British marques changed hands, often not to their betterment. It's nice to have the assessment of someone that really knows the brand. I could probably pick you brain for hours but as a general rule are pipes produced before 1970 usually a better pipe (noted exceptions taken)? My collection is largely comprised of Rhodies and Bulls and I'd like to add a Barling bulldog as a representative example of the marque so your assessment has been very helpful. Thanks again. Dutch

 

[doctorbob]

I had a BB&S silver mounted with a 1978 (IIRC) hallmark, there was nothing really wrong with it. At what you paid, it is almost impossible to NOT come out ahead.
Doc

 

[sablebrush52]

I could probably pick you brain for hours but as a general rule are pipes produced before 1970 usually a better pipe (noted exceptions taken)?

By reports, there was a decline in quality once the family left the building, so 1970 is a bit late to use as a milestone. If you're looking for some kind of assurance, stick with "Barling's Make" pipes. But you'll miss out on a ton of superbly made pipes. The pipes made before 1970, when made in the original factories, tend to be pretty good. Look for pipes with a script "Barling" , a four digit model number whose first digit ranges from 2 - 6, with the words "London Made" underneath. By and large, the shaping is the similar to the Family made product, as are the stems. As time goes on, the stampings, shaping and stems really vary from the family made product.
The pipes made later are even more variable because they're not actually made by Barling. But even then, the subcontractors turned out a lot of excellent pipes. Charatan isn't exactly chopped liver.

 

[agnosticpipe]

"Charatan isn't exactly chopped liver." :rofl:
Jesse, I don't know if this pipe smokes so good because of what I did to it, or if it had a lot going for it to begin with. I've gotten in the habit of reaming out the draught hole in the shank from mortise to bowl either 9/64 or 5/8. Because of the pencil shank on this pipe I went for 9/64 as I didn't want to stress the thin briar. It was pretty close to that to begin with, so mostly what I accomplished was clearing out some gunk and making the hole smooth. The other thing I do sometimes is open up the button slot a little and smooth the edges, which is what I did with this pipe. Think I'll smoke it again today... (hey, it's had 24 hrs. to rest!)
Anyway, I'd like to thank all the responders for the wealth of information, and of course Jesse, the guru of all things Barling.

 

[cigrmaster]

jeez guys, you would think that jesse is some kind of barling expert, ok maybe he really is.
Orley, I offered the guy selling the barling for 348.00 somewhere around 195.00. There are issues with that pipe and no way is it worth anywhere near what he is asking. It has been sitting there a long time and it will continue to sit at the price he is asking, In another couple of months, he will go down to the price I offered, bank on it. lol

 

[agnosticpipe]

Harris, that is definitely a cool old Barling, if for no other reason than I simply like the shape. I'm rooting for you to get it eventually.