So I started smoking a pipe about 2 months ago after being a long time cigarette smoker. It's definitely something I'll be doing for a very long time. I have a few pounds safely cellared away at this point, and as of now it's all Va's and VaPers. I've read dozens of forums and articles on the subject but there's one thing I can't find any information on- will the tobacco eventually be so old it just goes bad even if properly stored? I'm currently 29 years old and have some decent discretionary funds to build up a pretty good sized cellar relatively quickly. At 29 I (hopefully) have many many more years of smoking, but if I cellar up a lifetime supply or close to a lifetime supply within the next let's say 2-4 years would that tobacco even be good by the time I'm 75 in 40+ years? I plan on also getting more kinds other than Va's and VaPers (no aromatics for me, for now anyways)
Cellaring- How Long is too Long?
- Thread starter HalfMadHatter
- Start date
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I'm not sure you'll get a definitive answer to this question (or any other, for that matter; we are an eclectic bunch). I've been cellaring for around 25 years and my stock has suffered most of the typical mishaps over that time: rust, mold, lack of improvement, etc, in varying degrees.
At your age and probable event horizon, I would stick with continuing to cellar VAs and VaPers. Those seem to have the longest legs and are most likely to improve for several decades. Other types vary greatly in longevity. Latakia and Orientals can weaken in strength quite a bit over decades but perhaps the Lat bombs would survive, if not thrive. Aros don't really improve with age (at least the topping/casing surely doesn't). Burleys are somewhere in between. With enough PG though, they can outlive the seal on their containers. Unfortunately, PG-laced blends often aren't the ones some folks like to cellar. As always, YMMV and best of luck!
At your age and probable event horizon, I would stick with continuing to cellar VAs and VaPers. Those seem to have the longest legs and are most likely to improve for several decades. Other types vary greatly in longevity. Latakia and Orientals can weaken in strength quite a bit over decades but perhaps the Lat bombs would survive, if not thrive. Aros don't really improve with age (at least the topping/casing surely doesn't). Burleys are somewhere in between. With enough PG though, they can outlive the seal on their containers. Unfortunately, PG-laced blends often aren't the ones some folks like to cellar. As always, YMMV and best of luck!
Thanks for the info. I don't think anything I have stored now has any PG but hell it might. I was thinking of maybe vacuum sealing or mylar sealing the tins and jars, and then putting them all into some sort of relatively sealed tote with desiccant inside to keep the atmosphere that the double sealed containers are in dry to prevent rust. I wouldn't go to these lengths on anything I'm planning on cellaring for less than say 30 years. The only real reason I'm doing this is frugality. I know many blends get better with age but it's really more for insurance against insane taxes/prices and availability issues. I'd hate to have to one day grow all my own which let's face it probably wouldn't exactly be up to snuff with the stuff produced by professionals now
That's a hard question to answer. In a vacuum, 50 years or more for a Virginia or vaper. But, as @Elric mentioned, the worst sometimes happens.
If you look around here long enough you'll find other threads regarding advice/do's/don'ts on long term storage.
I've seen it stated that you do NOT want to mylar tins because the metals of the 2 materials in contact will increase chances of rust.
Most seem to feel that mylar OR jars are sufficient...
Many seem to have had decent success for 1-2 decades in manufacturers tins.
My advice is if you want to continue smoking tobacco well into the future, get it now. It will never be cheaper or more available than it is today. As to how the long term aging will affect the tobacco, it is a crapshoot. It will be different. Whether or not you like the changes will be for you to decide. I have a good cellar built up but like yourself, my cellar was created as insurance against insane taxes/prices and availability issues and not so much for the aged tobacco aspect.
Some great information about aging, cellaring and storage can be found here:
The Pipe Tobacco Aging, Storage and Cellaring FAQ: Aging
A compendium of knowledge intended for the pipe-smoking enthusiast interested in the aging, storage and cellaring of pipe tobacco.
pipe-club.com
Cellaring for the long haul is always a good idea but I'd slow down before you jump that deep into pipe tobacco. Realistically we're not staring down a tobaccopocalypse anytime within the next few years at least so you have time to make sure you actually want to smoke until you're 75 before buying a lifetime's supply.
Not only do you risk realizing you're not that into it after having bought dozens of pounds of baccy you also risk buying into blends you find aren't your favorites later on. A dragon's hoard of Virginias won't do you much good if in a year you realize you're really into Lat bombs, codger burleys or aromatics. Not to mention specific blends.
Take the time to explore everything and really nail down your favorites before you throw down for 50 years worth of tobacco.
Anecdotal...
For our monthly pipe club meeting last week, I dug a 2015 tin of Esoterica Margate (English) and a 2016 tin of Torben Danske Black Velvet (aromatic). Both were still fairly moist and both smelled and tasted good. I was told by one member that the Black Velvet tasted better than the newer Black Velvet he recently smoked.
IN MY OPINION, some of the aromatics that I have smoked do get better over time as the flavors meld together more. The toppings and casing can change by becoming more muted and that will change the taste and aroma.
For our monthly pipe club meeting last week, I dug a 2015 tin of Esoterica Margate (English) and a 2016 tin of Torben Danske Black Velvet (aromatic). Both were still fairly moist and both smelled and tasted good. I was told by one member that the Black Velvet tasted better than the newer Black Velvet he recently smoked.
IN MY OPINION, some of the aromatics that I have smoked do get better over time as the flavors meld together more. The toppings and casing can change by becoming more muted and that will change the taste and aroma.
Yep, you'll know well enough in advance if there is a reason to start putting away tobacco for the next 40-50 years, seems a waste of time and money. Had no idea there were dozens of pipe smoking forums but shouldn't have taken more than a few Google suggestions, not reading dozens, lol, to answer the question. Hyperbole aside, if there are some things you like buy it and put away as much as you like, but there will likely be other things you like sometime down the road. Seems more a "thing" than a lifetime need at your age. Just cellar, replenish and refresh as you see fit and don't get all Mormon in the basement about it (saw a real Apocalypse cellar of stores once - nice folks, but took it very, very seriously).
The sky is not falling in. I wouldn't plan to have tobacco stored to long term- say 20 years as that horizon.
Welcome and good luck!
Welcome and good luck!
That's my line of thinking. It will only get more expensive or harder to get. Luckily I am probably the least picky a person can ever be so as long as the tobacco isn't dried to dust or moldy I'm sure I won't dislike the changes
Then all the more reason to go slow. Long term, many blends will eventually be at or under the general inflation going forward. Several dozens will be way higher due to short supply and magical thinking.
Me as well. I'm generally not too picky and can smoke a lot of different tobaccos and be happy with them. The only exception is that I don't typically care for most aromatics.
I have about 30 opened tins right now of all different kinds to see what I like most. It's just like with food I don't care what I eat it all tastes good to me, but certain things have a slight edge on the rest
If, at the time you cellared your tobacco, the Presidents of the United States ranged from Woodrow Wilson to Harry S. Truman, then that's probably too long.
I only have 2 aromatics right now and neither seem too strong. A house blend from gatlinburlier in Gatlinburg and 1 tin of university flake. I like the UF alot more but definitely won't be buying many others if any. Maybe one here and there just to have something different
Worst comes to worst I can just sell them off later for minimal loss or to break even or profit. That's not the goal but always an option
That's fair, I'd still say there's no rush. If you haven't already I'd throw my hat in for buying good bulk Virginias, especially if you're planning on long term cellaring. Stuff like
- Newminster No. 400,
- Peter Stokkebye Luxury Navy, Twist and Bullseye Flakes,
- Gawith Hoggarth & Co Bright CR Flake and Best Brown,
- Cornell & Diehl's bulk virginias like Derringer/Winchester/Yorktown
- and Sutliff's standout bulk virginias like 707, 507c and 515
Keep in mind that selling huge quantities of tobacco isn't the easiest or legalist thing in the world already. It may get exponentially more difficult over time.
Absolutely guaranteed. Everything in the universe eventually peaks and croaks out. When that will happen is a guess. T'were I you, I'd aim for smoking what I have before it hits 20.
I've smoked blends that were 60, 70, and 100 years old and they were generally quite awful. Blends that are 35 thru 50 can be very good, or beginning their trip to the graveyard.
And some blends don't really change much at all, except to eventually go lifeless and strange.