Castello - Old Catalogues / Cost And Perception Back In The Day?

[fishingandpipes]

The Dunhill thread over here
http://pipesmagazine.com/forums/topic/dunhill-pipe-prices-in-the-60s?replies=18
has made me wonder what Castello pipes were viewed as and what they were priced at when they hit the market back in 1947 and through the years. I've also always wondered what the perception of them as an Italian product were as they launched just coming out of WWII.
I'd love to see old Castello catalogues if they exist, I don't think I've ever seen any at all.
We know Kaywoodie was once priced higher than Dunhill and we know what Dunhills cost post-War and beyond, but I'm curious where Castello sat when they came out, and the story behind how they grew.
Anyone know?

 

[daveinlax]

There are some old ads in the Wally Frank catalogs on Chris Keene's Pipe Pages if they're working. They're interesting. 8O

 

[fishingandpipes]

Many of the pages on Chris' site seem broken / lead back to the main page but based on what did load, a Sea Rock would cost $18-$24 o_O
I hadn't known about this site before, thanks!

 

[daveinlax]

We know that Castello's founder Carlo Scotti admired Dunhill and adopted their confident pricing. I really don't know how they were accepted by smokers back in the early days except they survived, thrived and became one of the top collectible brand perhaps only topped by Dunhill (???) at some point. Collectors wanted more than the small Sea Rocks that Wally Frank and later Hallco imported. There was a thriving gray market in white bar Castello's from Italy. I've got a small collection of Castello paper ephemera but it's nothing like the great Dunhill paper available out there.
I'm always on the lookout for Anything Castello Related especially epoca's in any shape, unique pipes in shapes 15, 215, 30 and 34's tampers, any point of sale and display items and paper! 8O

 

[npod]

For early Castello research (in reference to the OP question about price in U.S. in the past), one needs to research Wally Frank. He sold many different pipes, for example Comoy's amongst others, eventually Castello. He was the original distributor for Castello in the U.S.. I have a large repository of printed information in my files, both U.S. and Europe, but it is difficult to scan to a general board for review. In summary, there is very little hard research data on the early years. However, around the early 1960's, we start to see hard data on scanned catalogs. It is fascinating to research these nuggets. I'll attach a few screen shots I've collected.
1962: Sea Rock $22

1964: Sea Rock $24.95

 

[npod]

That second catalog picture is very cool. Why? Because you can see the shape 84 (Hawkbill) already being labelled by the early 1960's. This is the kind of stuff that makes collecting Castellol pipes so rewarding.
Oh, and don't forget to notice the fascinating quote, "The Gayest Pipe in Your Collection." :laughat:

 

[georged]

Dave --
Whatever happened to that massive hawkbill collection that was a show staple back in the 90's? I heard the guy who put it together died, and it was sold. I don't know if it was kept together, though.

 

[npod]

This is one of my favorite pipe pictures (source: http://www.fincatolacasadelhabano.com/). I actually printed and framed this picture in my man cave. I love seeing a "group" of Castello's together.

 

[fishingandpipes]

I've given up hope finding a solid Epoca.
I'm curious about the hawkbill collection too. They just don't make them like that any more. I saw this Fiamatta show up on smokingpipes and I think I still have friction burns on my butt from how fast my wallet came out.

 

[fishingandpipes]

If I find an old #10 Old Antiquari with a briar band like GLP has I may get more friction burns tho.
The new version of the #10 is awful.

 

[npod]

Neat. Here is a cool link to a Wally Frank Catalog from 1939 before the Castello years. Not really related to the OP question, but intriguing nonetheless. Link is below the picture.

https://www.smugmug.com/gallery/n-7C3W9n/i-NfKvGKd

 

[daveinlax]

Whatever happened to that massive hawkbill collection that was a show staple back in the 90's? I heard the guy who put it together died, and it was sold. I don't know if it was kept together, though.

Mike McCain Aka Donkey Nuts passed away a couple years ago and Col. Mike Davis Aka Pipestem retired from the hobby years ago. Their combined collections were a sight to see and inspired my humble little collection. I don't know where DN's pipes went but at least some of Pipestem's pipes were sold on eBay by Pipestud. Mike Davis' shape 84 epoca and a pipe rack have a happy home with great memories and respect in my collection. Paging John Seiler. 8O

 

[snagstangl]

Did someone like groupings of castellos?

 

[daveinlax]

Those pictures are unstamped Castello's ready for selection by PCCA's Bob Hamlin probably with an very young Marco of Novelli. Hallco probably was still the official importer so I'd say this was a Cantu' approved gray market trip. The buyer would select pipes and Franco Coppo would decide which of those you could have and probably add a few that he thought you needed to round out your group. As I've heard the stories then you'd go to lunch then Mr. Coppo would take the pipes to grade and stamp them. When you selected the pipes you wouldn't know what the grade/cost would be depending on his mood after lunch. From what I've heard from Bob you wouldn't argue the grade/cost if you wanted to continue as a Castello dealer. 8O

 

[oldgeezersmoker]

The new version of the #10 is awful.

If you look at a reasonably wide cross section of Italian retailers, going beyond site sponsors, you will find many "versions" of the 10. Same is true for 11's and 55's. One shop has more variations on the 33 than I have ever seen. Another shop seems to be in love with 55's and another, which only puts up a few pipes at a time, consistently has the damndest Old Antiquaris I have ever seen. I always look twice when I see an auction on eBay that has their shop stamp. Nobody seems to get more than one or two 84's in at a time, but the variations can be striking. That is true for every shape I have seen.
The US importer does a good job, but every individual involved in the distribution chain, from Franco Coppo on down, is influenced by their perception of what the market demands.

 

[cigrmaster]

Back around 1999-2000 maybe? I was buying Castello's from a company named Agide. His prices were really cheap especially because of the value of the Euro as it had just come out. I bought a bunch of Castello's from him and that was my introduction to their incredible smoking properties.
Were these pipes considered to be in that grey market or were those something else. I do remember Hamlin from the old alt.pipes news group. He was an interesting guy.

 

[oldgeezersmoker]

I too bought many Castellos from Agide, who owns a shop in Ravenna, in the pre-2001 time frame. He still has a great eye for Castellos, but is no longer active on the internet.

 

[ssjones]

This is a great thread, there really isn't much Castello lore on the internet.

 

[oldgeezersmoker]

This is a great thread, there really isn't much Castello lore on the internet.

There is even less now, I just discovered. There was a two part series by Bob Hamlin that he wrote for the newsletter he put out under his PCCA trade name that went into great detail about Castello history, shapes, and grading. It was written around the mid 1990’s. It is of course dated, and some small portion of the information may have been wrong when originally written, but it was a great starting place. I consulted it occasionally through pipes.org. Unfortunately, they have updated and purged their archive, and it is no longer accessible.. I have not been able to find it elsewhere.