Brief GH Brown Flake Unscented Review
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As far as it is within my ability to figure out what people mean by Lakeland essence, it would be the the flavor imparted by Rose Geranium and/ or tonquin used in many, but not all, of the "Aromatic ' blends. I have never, ever gotten a hint of these flavorings in Brown Flake or Dark Flake Unscented. I smoke a good bit of Brown Flake Scented (now called Brown Flake A), and the difference between it and the unscented version is, and always has been, night and day. To me, to say that something is "floral" is just too broad a term. I could apply it to any number of GH and non GH blends. I suppose leaf sources, that do change over time with any manufacturer, could account for some variance in taste over time, but I simply have not detected anything so dramatic as others report.
(Posted before I read the entire thread)
My last order of Dark Birdseye Vintage Cut had zero floral/aromatic essence. Fantastic blend, btw.
Before that I did have an order of Louisiana Flake that smelled of my grandmother's hand soap, so some cross contamination happened. I may order another batch if it ever shows up again...
My last order of Dark Birdseye Vintage Cut had zero floral/aromatic essence. Fantastic blend, btw.
Before that I did have an order of Louisiana Flake that smelled of my grandmother's hand soap, so some cross contamination happened. I may order another batch if it ever shows up again...
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I think this is it, the rose geranium and tonquin flavour. People describe St Bruno, Condor etc. as 'Lakeland' blends (admittedly this may just be poor use of the term - especially as these were originally Liverpudlian and Irish respectively) and these aren't even made by G&H, so can't have the mysterious 'Lakeland' essence. The thing is, sometimes I think I have tasted this in the Unscented flakes and sometimes I haven't - but this could be down to how the tobacconist has stored it!
I've also often wondered if what we get in the UK is different to what ends up in the US - I have been smoking G&H blends for as long as I've been smoking (not as long as some on here, but long enough) and I haven't noticed this dramatic change. I'm not disputing that some batches may have a weaker topping or other variances, but I've certainly had recent stuff bought within the last year or so that has been just as strong as before (unlike the aforementioned Condor and St Bruno).
It all boils down to laymen speak. So, if someone doesn't know exactly what rose geranium or tonquin smells like, they merely associate these Lakelands down to other things that they smell like. They smell like those decorative soaps ladies used to decorate their bathrooms with in the 50's, 60's, and 70's. Now, we call them old lady soaps. But, these were also scented with rose geranium and Tonquin, and those other lakeland smells. Therefore, when we smell Condor, we associate those with those decorative soap smells. I have no idea what Condor is/was scented with, but it does smell like an old lady soap.
The term "Granny panties" came from Harris, who is no longer amongst us. He had weird carnal knowledges that I am unfamiliar with, so I have no idea why he associated them with elderly panties.
Maybe... but if so, I be damned if it didn't penetrate plastic and a whole pound of unscented flakes equally down to the core.
I will put together a tasting set of samples this weekend.
I've never tried any of their blends but that seems to be the prevailing theme on the forum.. Many have noticed a precipitous drop off in the sauce department.
Absolutely, I can agree with that. But some of the 'Lakeland' blends don't have the rose geranium/tonquin flavouring (though I think 'old lady soap' is a good catch-all!).
You're probably right, that doesn't make sense. But I certainly have had the Unscented flakes over the last 10 years that have been genuinely 'unscented', as well as some that have some light 'essence', so this variance isn't a recent thing.
And, I think it's a positive. Instead of denying it, or "implying" that we are wrong, crazy, or just lying, they should just embrace this. I've always said that I would love to know what these stronger flakes tasted like without any sauce. But, at a point when I should be excited, I find the company throwing shade and putting us down. I just don't understand this treatment of customers. It's as turn off.
I am setting up the tastings because I am not wrong, and I want you all to experience it for yourselves.
I'm not certain that what people refer to as Lakeland is just boiled down to Geranium and Tonquin. I can't speak for everyone, but I would assume that any of the things that they scent their tobaccos with would qualify as Lakeland. But, even their cherry, seems to be very proprietorial to almost have that rose geranium-esque flavor also. I think this is what has led to jokes amongst us about the guys at GH just splashing that stuff into everything that they make. Of, course, I have no idea what is happening there, nor does anyone else... but with what we have experienced from there, the jokes can be deduced.
I bet the OP did not think this thread would go this direction
As I recall discussion from 10 years or so ago, you guys in the UK were adamant that there was no scents in "some" of their blends, while us Americans were arguing that there was. The differences in the arguments were the locations from which we were located. Make your deductions from that.
I think that it is all fitting. One couldn't make a review of Three Nuns or Escudo without someone making comparisons to the older versions. This discussion seems very amiable in comparison to some Three Nun discussions I have seen.
He kinda tempted fate, though.
futureman said:
Now I'm really curious how the bulk stuff is packaged for transport across the ocean. I'm pretty sure that C&D Virginia Flake doesn't start off life as a cherry blend (right, @cosmicfolklore ?), but as I had ordered a few bulk cherry blends at the same time, my sample was (and still is) thoroughly contaminated, and that's after a couple days' journey from SC to IA. Perhaps that cross-pollination sometimes also happens on the voyage from Kendal to the States?
To have an opposing view or opinion does not have to mean war. So far, this all seems quite amiable to me.
They seem to be using boxes now. But, when I ordered mine almost a decade ago, it usually came in big bags. Sometimes I would order just a pound, but many times five pounds of bulk, always came in a bag.
Inconsistency is part of the charm of hand made British made blends. And in today's world where sourcing is more complicated, consistency is not going to improve.
Frankly, I like the variations. They may be a bit more pronounced than some of their American counterparts, but I find them more interesting and richer in flavors than the majority of current US product.
A couple of years back I picked up a few pounds of Brown Flake unscented as well as Aromatic and the difference between the to is not subtle. BTW, the Brown Flake Unscented I bought at that time didn't have any noticeable "Lakeland" scent. It also seems really inaccurate to use that term in respect to G&H product in general. The scented products I like, such as Glengarry Flake, don't taste like Grannie Pants. They taste of spices, like licorice and tonquin. With other blends I get rose geranium and other flavors.
This Lakeland thing is interesting. Years ago I got samples from a blender who used only selected Virginias, without flavorings, to get that floral balance. Part of my education in tobacco blending. Some Virginias can be quite floral, though I usually relate that to them being quite old. So I guess it's not necessary to use a Lakeland "essence" to get that result.
I enjoy G&H's responses, even when she's disagreeing with something I said. I'm happy she's here, willing to participate. She's direct. And unlike anyone here, she's actually in the factory.
In my work, everybody's output gets reviewed, and sometimes that review can be expressed in very unflattering (though often hilarious) ways. People with thin skins are going to have a very hard time of it. Standards are very high and you're expected to be expert in what you do.
These days it's popular for everyone to act like they're an expert, without having really done the work. You're an expert just because you say you are. Sorry, I'm not buying it.
Real skills are hard earned, and part of that is not failing to make mistakes but knowing how to rectify them. I guess I must have done that well enough, since Warner Animation continues to pay me a retainer between assignments. They only do that with a literal handful of people that they find to be essential and don't want to risk being poached by another studio.
If some of you want to block her because you don't like what she has to say, that's your privilege. Bubbles are a popular thing these days. Just keep in mind what always happens to bubbles.
I don't see anything in @gawithhoggarth replies that rise to the level you are speaking of. Basically they have said that nothing in the manufacturing process has changed, and some refuse to accept that. Same sh*t, different day , except everybody gets more emphatic with each iteration.
Ha ha, I'm off it. So, I will see if anyone wants a sample party by this weekend... and if not, I will just be off it.
I'm glad you guys like their type of engagement. I just find it unusual.
I'm glad you guys like their type of engagement. I just find it unusual.
The Anglophobia is strong in this thread. It cracks me up, reminds me of Kevin Kline's character from A Fish Called Wanda.