Barling ?

[Day2Day]

The Majority of the pipes I have are Kaywoodie, Peterson and Savinelli. I have for some time been curious about Barling's and Dunhill, problem is other than they are high end pipes I know nothing about them. While searching on eBay estates this morning I pulled the trigger and bought a Barling Granet Grain 4755 shipping and tax 87.57.

Of course, the pipe has been cleaned up for the pictures and looks to be in really good shape. My question was this a good price for a used Barling. I'll add pictures when it arrives next week.

 

[Sig]

You're in the right place.
The resident Barling expert should be along soon.

 

[RustiePyles CPG]

Barling is one of those pipes that you need to have a very comprehensive understanding of if you’re going to be forking over your hard earned dollars for an expensive one. Barlings span the entire spectrum of quality and collectibility from very high end and collectible to absolute garbage. Some like the Peterson made Barlings are easily identifiable, while others are not. The stampings are a landmine filled hedge maze of font/stamping if, ands, & buts.

Our very own @sablebrush52 is the Bard of Barlings and knows more about them than probably anyone else on the planet. He’s who most of us turn to when we’re unsure of a Barlings pedigree or origin.

 

[SpuddsBuckley]

I have a Barling Marylebone Fossil (1820) that I use primarily for English blends, and I love it.

 

[sablebrush52]

The Majority of the pipes I have are Kaywoodie, Peterson and Savinelli. I have for some time been curious about Barling's and Dunhill, problem is other than they are high end pipes I know nothing about them. While searching on eBay estates this morning I pulled the trigger and bought a Barling Granet Grain 4755 shipping and tax 87.57.

Of course, the pipe has been cleaned up for the pictures and looks to be in really good shape. My question was this a good price for a used Barling. I'll add pictures when it arrives next week.

Without pictures to show the condition of the Barling that you bought, potentially it's an excellent price. When the Barling product line up was remade in late 1962, the Garnet Grain replaced the Ye Olde Wood line of pipes.

There are two sites for learning about different brands that I recommend that you visit, first Pipedia:

Pipedia

pipedia.org

The article on Barlings:

Barling - Pipedia

pipedia.org

The article on Dunhills:

Dunhill - Pipedia

pipedia.org

The other site for you to visit is Pipephil:

Pipes: Logos & Estampilles - Logos & Markings

This website displays stampings on shank and stem of pipes. About 3000 brands are referenced.

www.pipephil.eu

And there are still others more specialized, but these two are a good way to start.

 

[anotherbob]

unless you're looking for resale value or impressing snobs the answer to the question of was the price right or fine... is do you feel that it's worth what you get out of it. Pipes are art. That's part of the price. Is a certain painting really worth more then another painting? Really? Only as a matter of taste or market value.
Or in other words if you're asking will I be able to turn it over and make money.... That's the only version of the is it worth the price that has a legit and solid answer.
That said if it's a decent pipe you enjoy and think is fine and pretty and special then you got a great deal.
Side note one way to always answer the question if you paid an o.k. price is to ask what else you could have got for the same amount of money and are you happy you got the thing you bought over the alternative.

 

[Sig]

unless you're looking for resale value or impressing snobs the answer to the question of was the price right or fine... is do you feel that it's worth what you get out of it. Pipes are art. That's part of the price. Is a certain painting really worth more then another painting? Really? Only as a matter of taste or market value.
Or in other words if you're asking will I be able to turn it over and make money.... That's the only version of the is it worth the price that has a legit and solid answer.
That said if it's a decent pipe you enjoy and think is fine and pretty and special then you got a great deal.
Side note one way to always answer the question if you paid an o.k. price is to ask what else you could have got for the same amount of money and are you happy you got the thing you bought over the alternative.

My understanding is he is wondering if it was a good price in general.
Or can these pipes be had for $15.
In that case, the "worth" to him would be important.
I know a bit about pipes, but more about cars. I know that a one year difference, and slightly different trim package can be worth thousands.
For instance.....
Go price a 1962, 1963, and 1964 Corvette coupes. You'll see the 63 is exponentially more than the other two.
Due to the 63 having the first and only fastback split window design. It was discontinued in 64.
They only made about 10,000 of them.

 

[Day2Day]

Without pictures to show the condition of the Barling that you bought, potentially it's an excellent price. When the Barling product line up was remade in late 1962, the Garnet Grain replaced the Ye Olde Wood line of pipes.

There are two sites for learning about different brands that I recommend that you visit, first Pipedia:

Pipedia

pipedia.org

The article on Barlings:

Barling - Pipedia

pipedia.org

The article on Dunhills:

Dunhill - Pipedia

pipedia.org

The other site for you to visit is Pipephil:

Pipes: Logos & Estampilles - Logos & Markings

This website displays stampings on shank and stem of pipes. About 3000 brands are referenced.

www.pipephil.eu

And there are still others more specialized, but these two are a good way to start.

thank you for the information. I'll post pictures when it gets to me. And check these links out after dinner been a long day, ready for supper and porch and pipe time right now.

 

[anotherbob]

My understanding is he is wondering if it was a good price in general.
Or can these pipes be had for $15.
In that case, the "worth" to him would be important.
I know a bit about pipes, but more about cars. I know that a one year difference, and slightly different trim package can be worth thousands.
For instance.....
Go price a 1962, 1963, and 1964 Corvette coupes. You'll see the 63 is exponentially more than the other two.
Due to the 63 having the first and only fastback split window design. It was discontinued in 64.
They only made about 10,000 of them.

I guess what I am thinking is you can always find a similar pipe much cheaper or much more expensive. There isn't really a proper price. So at the end of it the question is how do you feel about the price. Now retail for new is different.
What you're saying about the cars reminds me of a personal experience my family had. When my Grandmother passed we sold her Hummels (a weird porcelain figures that old ladies love for some reason) and it's a good thing we got them appraised because the one figure had the right color pants. The pants color changed that one from a few hundred to around 20 thousand something. Why because the one color is rarer then the others. Strange thing was how little time it took to sell it. Gave the impression that there are many old ladies out there that are just waiting for these hummels to show up for sale.

 

[Day2Day]

Without pictures to show the condition of the Barling that you bought, potentially it's an excellent price. When the Barling product line up was remade in late 1962, the Garnet Grain replaced the Ye Olde Wood line of pipes.

There are two sites for learning about different brands that I recommend that you visit, first Pipedia:

Pipedia

pipedia.org

The article on Barlings:

Barling - Pipedia

pipedia.org

The article on Dunhills:

Dunhill - Pipedia

pipedia.org

The other site for you to visit is Pipephil:

Pipes: Logos & Estampilles - Logos & Markings

This website displays stampings on shank and stem of pipes. About 3000 brands are referenced.

www.pipephil.eu

And there are still others more specialized, but these two are a good way to start.

From what I can tell the one I bought is post transition I think some where in the 70's. these screen shots are from eBay.

 

[sablebrush52]

From what I can tell the one I bought is post transition I think some where in the 70's. these screen shots are from eBay.
View attachment 405393View attachment 405394View attachment 405395View attachment 405396

I dropped the use of the Transition definitions because they aren't accurate and few people , if any, can tell the difference between a transition piece and an earlier post transition piece. I substitute it with Family Era and Corporate Era. More accurate.

I believe that this pipe is from the 1960's, According to the datasheet that Jon Guss sent me, the Garnet Grain was out of production by 1968. It's interesting because there's no TVF stamp, which was removed for 1963 and then restored, but the model number is on the other side, which is more typical of the later 1960's.

The stem is a replacement. Barling stems were not matte and the button is not a Barling button. Also, the line up is a little off. The stampings are crisp and the bowl is clean, so while you didn't steal it, you also didn't overpay.

Were there no pictures of the rim?

 

[warren99]

I dropped the use of the Transition definitions because they aren't accurate and few people , if any, can tell the difference between a transition piece and an earlier post transition piece. I substitute it with Family Era and Corporate Era. More accurate.

I believe that this pipe is from the 1960's, According to the datasheet that Jon Guss sent me, the Garnet Grain was out of production by 1968. It's interesting because there's no TVF stamp, which was removed for 1963 and then restored, but the model number is on the other side, which is more typical of the later 1960's.

The stem is a replacement. Barling stems were not matte and the button is not a Barling button. Also, the line up is a little off. The stampings are crisp and the bowl is clean, so while you didn't steal it, you also didn't overpay.

Were there no pictures of the rim?

From what I’ve read, the transition pipes were still made by the family after the corporate takeover for a period of several months, and were inscribed with “Barling’s Make” in block letters but had four, instead of three, numbers Imprinted on them, in contrast to the “family era” pipes. Is that not accurate?

 

[Day2Day]

Were there no pictures of the rim?

only 1 again thank you for your help.

 

[sablebrush52]

only 1 again thank you for your help.

View attachment 405436

The reason I always want to see the rim and bite zones on a pipe is because they tell the most about the way that the pipes has been treated by its previous owners. This photo confirms that the pipe has been lightly used.

I can now see the remains of a crossed Barling stem stamp. So, the satin finish of the stem was achieved by its owner, because Barling did not make stems in a satin finish. The stem looks a bit more like a Barling stem from this angle, but the button is very high. I'm wondering if the stem was immersed in some deoxidizer like La Belle Epoque? It there was significant oxidation it will result in a matte or satin finish.

In any event, the bowl looks little used, easy to clean up and hopefully, to neutralize, so you are likely to get some great smoking from it.

 

[sablebrush52]

From what I’ve read, the transition pipes were still made by the family after the corporate takeover for a period of several months, and were inscribed with “Barling’s Make” in block letters but had four, instead of three, numbers Imprinted on them, in contrast to the “family era” pipes. Is that not accurate?

Not exactly. The Barling Family was retained to run the company for about 20 months after selling to Finlay. During most of that period there were no changes to the nomenclature, no changes to the model numbers. There remains no way to tell a pipe made before the sale of the company from a pipe made after.

That is, until mid 1962, when Barling released its 150th Anniversary catalog with pictures of pipes bearing the new four digit model numbers. My copy includes a price list dated to June 2nd.

Gone are the Nichols numbers for the American market. Instead there was a standardized 4 digit model number with the first digit ranging from 2 through 6, which is used for all pipes, regardless of markets. The traditional block “BARLING’S MAKE” logo stamp was retained. Also in June of 1962, the family was sacked.

In November of 1962 the Dealer’s Catalogue was published, with the new cursive Barling logo stamp and a completely revised line of pipes. This catalogue introduced the Garnet Grain line of pipes.

In February of 1963 Imperial exercised its option to buy Finlay, ending the so called Transition Period.

For most of the so called Transition Period the nomenclature on the pipes is exactly the same as in the so called Pre Transition Period, and the family still ran B. Barling & Sons.

That’s why I dropped those terms.

Also, even before Finlay bought the company, model numbers weren’t strictly 3 digit Nichols numbers for the US, and four digit model numbers for everywhere else. Some of the model numbers were 2 digits, a few were unchanged since the beginning, like the 71A, which appeared in the 1914 catalog and which was still in the lineup until 1962.

The three and four digit numbers are mostly correct, but they are a simplification of reality.

 

[warren99]

Not exactly. The Barling Family was retained to run the company for about 20 months after selling to Finlay. During most of that period there were no changes to the nomenclature, no changes to the model numbers. There remains no way to tell a pipe made before the sale of the company from a pipe made after.

That is, until mid 1962, when Barling released its 150th Anniversary catalog with pictures of pipes bearing the new four digit model numbers. My copy includes a price list dated to June 2nd.

Gone are the Nichols numbers for the American market. Instead there was a standardized 4 digit model number with the first digit ranging from 2 through 6, which is used for all pipes, regardless of markets. The traditional block “BARLING’S MAKE” logo stamp was retained. Also in June of 1962, the family was sacked.

In November of 1962 the Dealer’s Catalogue was published, with the new cursive Barling logo stamp and a completely revised line of pipes. This catalogue introduced the Garnet Grain line of pipes.

In February of 1963 Imperial exercised its option to buy Finlay, ending the so called Transition Period.

For most of the so called Transition Period the nomenclature on the pipes is exactly the same as in the so called Pre Transition Period, and the family still ran B. Barling & Sons.

That’s why I dropped those terms.

Also, even before Finlay bought the company, model numbers weren’t strictly 3 digit Nichols numbers for the US, and four digit model numbers for everywhere else. Some of the model numbers were 2 digits, a few were unchanged since the beginning, like the 71A, which appeared in the 1914 catalog and which was still in the lineup until 1962.

The three and four digit numbers are mostly correct, but they are a simplification of reality.

Interesting. Thanks for the info.

 

[xrundog]

That stem is oxidized like a bastard. That’s why it looks matte.

 

[SpuddsBuckley]

That stem is oxidized like a bastard. That’s why it looks matte.

Either that, or it's not the original. It doesn't look like a seamless fit at the joint.

 

[Choatecav]

Not exactly. The Barling Family was retained to run the company for about 20 months after selling to Finlay. During most of that period there were no changes to the nomenclature, no changes to the model numbers. There remains no way to tell a pipe made before the sale of the company from a pipe made after.

That is, until mid 1962, when Barling released its 150th Anniversary catalog with pictures of pipes bearing the new four digit model numbers. My copy includes a price list dated to June 2nd.

Gone are the Nichols numbers for the American market. Instead there was a standardized 4 digit model number with the first digit ranging from 2 through 6, which is used for all pipes, regardless of markets. The traditional block “BARLING’S MAKE” logo stamp was retained. Also in June of 1962, the family was sacked.

In November of 1962 the Dealer’s Catalogue was published, with the new cursive Barling logo stamp and a completely revised line of pipes. This catalogue introduced the Garnet Grain line of pipes.

In February of 1963 Imperial exercised its option to buy Finlay, ending the so called Transition Period.

For most of the so called Transition Period the nomenclature on the pipes is exactly the same as in the so called Pre Transition Period, and the family still ran B. Barling & Sons.

That’s why I dropped those terms.

Also, even before Finlay bought the company, model numbers weren’t strictly 3 digit Nichols numbers for the US, and four digit model numbers for everywhere else. Some of the model numbers were 2 digits, a few were unchanged since the beginning, like the 71A, which appeared in the 1914 catalog and which was still in the lineup until 1962.

The three and four digit numbers are mostly correct, but they are a simplification of reality.

See Jesse, now that you are a retired man of leisure, you have plenty of time to answer these type of questions..