Astley Pipes Authenticity

[captainsousie]

Interesting reflection.

To be clear, that's the evil side of me talking and if given the option, I'd still stick to what I did rather than making an extra $20. The few bucks I would have made would have been far outstripped by the loss of integrity and that's not something I would actually do.

I still own all the Astley pipes I bought and will likely never sell them for enough to make it worth it.

Side note: some pretty nice examples of both classic and Barry Jones made Astleys here.

 

[stetson]

EDIT: Fixed Capitalization in Title (See Rule 9)

Just FYI, there has been considerable misinformation concerning the Astleys pipe brand over the past few years. .... .... .... 2. Almost all of their house brand pipes were made either by Dunhill, Charatan, Ashton, never by Savinelli. 2. The Astley pipe tobaccos you see on the market today only bear their name because the trademark was purchased by another company, the blends are a very pale comparison to the blends available now. 3. The original Astley bran pipes had the stamping "109 Jermyn street" on the shank. The more recently produced pipe are stamped "Jermyn Street" without the "109" street number. 3. These more recent pipes have an unclear provenance. .... .... ....

Just to say that in 1995 I bought 2 Astleys from the Jermyn Street store - sold to me by Paul Bentley himself.

Both of these are marked : "Astley's Jermyn Street London" & the stems have "Handcut" embossed on them.

It would seem the Billiard is most likely Charatan made - going by the shape & the diamond shank - but I cannot say who could have made the Bent Pot. But the Cumberland stem makes me think it could be Ashton.

It would seem that not all Astleys marked Jermyn Street are of doubtful provenance - I wonder if the "Handcut" embossed on the stem is a pointer to authenticity (but cannot be sure).

 

[jguss]

I think the overall conclusion is pretty obvious. If you require clear provenance steer clear of Astley pipes; objective proof will be hard to find and the actions of the last owner of the brand created a cloud that may never dissipate. Alternatively if you trust your own judgment, independent of stampings, evaluate opportunities on a case by case basis and buy what attracts you and meets your standards.

Here as with most things expertise is important.

 

[condorlover1]

Goodness me. I remember that store as I used to browse in there after getting a haircut at Trumper's. Pay day in London in those days was an entire morning off whilst one settled bills, got a haircut, dropped by ones tobacconist and settled monthly accounts. I miss those civilized days before the world took leave of its senses. Who on earth would want to make 'knock offs' of Astley Pipes. Thats just wrong.

 

[Western Isles]

Thank you Don. I'll try to dig out some of my Astley research when my day job permits. As is so often the case, the public version of Astley's origins is false in almost every detail that is subject to verification; the company apparently dated from 1916, and its founder was never named Astley. The true story however is fascinating. I haven't looked into it for several years, and unfortunately many of my files are in my "work" office and therefore inaccessible thanks to closures precipitated by the coronavirus. I have fragments in my "home" office and will see what I can pull together.

When you get a chance, I would be very interested to read the results of your research!

 

[ssjones]

I assume we're talking about Moti Ezrati?
See an old thread here:

Astley Pipes = Re-Stamped Estate Pipes (Photos) :: General Pipe Smoking Discussion

A recent post on the old "Astley Assertion in Pipedia" thread ( http://pipesmagazine.com/forums/topic/astley-assertion-in-pipedia ) seems to give photographic proof of the assertion that "Astley" pipes being sold by James Upshall Co on ebay are really restamped estate pipes. It is truly...

pipesmagazine.com

He's deceased, but his widow was selling their Upshall/Asteley's pipes with quite a cloud over them.
Don't forget that James Upshall made Astley's as well, theres a thread here somewhere on those pipes as well.

 

[Western Isles]

I assume we're talking about Moti Ezrati?
See an old thread here:

Astley Pipes = Re-Stamped Estate Pipes (Photos) :: General Pipe Smoking Discussion

A recent post on the old "Astley Assertion in Pipedia" thread ( http://pipesmagazine.com/forums/topic/astley-assertion-in-pipedia ) seems to give photographic proof of the assertion that "Astley" pipes being sold by James Upshall Co on ebay are really restamped estate pipes. It is truly...

pipesmagazine.com

He's deceased, but his widow was selling their Upshall/Asteley's pipes with quite a cloud over them.
Don't forget that James Upshall made Astley's as well, theres a thread here somewhere on those pipes as well.

A good reference for those unaware of the hijacking of the Astley name, thanks for putting it there for readers new to the thread. I am hoping to hear about Jon's research into the origins and distant past of Astley's itself.

 

[jguss]

A good reference for those unaware of the hijacking of the Astley name, thanks for putting it there for readers new to the thread. I am hoping to hear about Jon's research into the origins and distant past of Astley's itself.

I’ll put it on the list but honestly am not sure when I’ll have time to get around to it. The story is a bit complicated and my notes are both scattered across several locations and disorganized but I promise Astley’s turn will come, even if it has to be in a highly truncated form.

 

[Western Isles]

I’ll put it on the list but honestly am not sure when I’ll have time to get around to it. The story is a bit complicated and my notes are both scattered across several locations and disorganized but I promise Astley’s turn will come, even if it has to be in a highly truncated form.

No worries, it will be worth waiting for. Thanks!

 

[sablebrush52]

I assume we're talking about Moti Ezrati?

That is correct.

 

[simong]

Don't forget that James Upshall made Astley's as well, theres a thread here somewhere on those pipes as well.

They made pipes for their 'Tudor Rose' line as well, along with Blakemar Briars & a few others. With so many pipe makers & tobacconists in London back then, great fun trying to decipher 'who made what for whom?' I've got pipes from Astleys, Inderwicks, Finlay's, Bewlays, Botterill & Sons, G. Smith. Terribly sad to think they've all gone now.

 

[condorlover1]

@simong. I mourn the passing of G. Smith on Charing Cross Road, Inderwicks and that place on Chancellory Lane. The only land mark from that era to survive is Drummonds Bank on Trafalgar Square by the Admiralty Arch. The chap at G. Smith name was Vivian something or other if I remember correctly.

 

[anotherbob]

Goodness me. I remember that store as I used to browse in there after getting a haircut at Trumper's. Pay day in London in those days was an entire morning off whilst one settled bills, got a haircut, dropped by ones tobacconist and settled monthly accounts. I miss those civilized days before the world took leave of its senses. Who on earth would want to make 'knock offs' of Astley Pipes. Thats just wrong.

the world has always been off it's rocker. Well at least the people. Sure there are occasions where they're reasonable about a few things at a time. But the world was just as bereft of it's sense as it's always been.

 

[simong]

@simong. I mourn the passing of G. Smith on Charing Cross Road, Inderwicks and that place on Chancellory Lane. The only land mark from that era to survive is Drummonds Bank on Trafalgar Square by the Admiralty Arch. The chap at G. Smith name was Vivian something or other if I remember correctly.

Vivian out the 'Young Ones?' Don't remember him being there. Lol. I think the last 'good one' in the city was on Victoria St. Jayems it was called. They had loads of old stock Comoy's hidden away in the drawers. Did you ever frequent Fribourg & Treyer? I would of loved to have seen that one. Teddy Bear shop or something now it is, terribly sad. As great as the Internet is nothing beats the smells & sights when entering an old tobacconists. A bygone era!

 

[paulfg]

@simong. I mourn the passing of G. Smith on Charing Cross Road, Inderwicks and that place on Chancellory Lane. The only land mark from that era to survive is Drummonds Bank on Trafalgar Square by the Admiralty Arch. The chap at G. Smith name was Vivian something or other if I remember correctly.

When my girlfriend (now wife) worked in the city she regularly used to be sent to Smiths to get various snuff's for me and some friends of mine