Any Commercial Pilots Here? I Have A Question.

[Akousticplyr]

Haha I was just looking up the weight used out of curiosity. I only speak 100LL and/or 50/50 with auto gas, hahaha. If it’s not Continental or Lycoming It’s as good as greek to me, hahaha.

Can’t imagine flying a fighter. Going from a 172 to a 185 was like going from a go cart to a ferarri to me.

When I went back to the 172 to get some night hours after a year in the 185 (185 is on floats) on the takeoff roll I was like “Jesus, is this thing even gonna get off the ground!?!?” Hahaha.

‘Here’s some more about JP-5 and JP-8. One of the things we have to be careful of is ship to shore and conversely shore to ship ops. The wrong gas refill means we can’t go to the boat. This is due to the flash point. It’s basically when fuel and vapor become volatile and can ignite. Some fuels have lower ones. We mandate higher flash points on the flight deck. Direct result of the USS Forrestal disaster in Vietnam.

JP-8 | High-quality jet fuel for military aviation use | Repsol - https://www.repsol.com/en/products-and-services/aviation/jp-8/index.cshtml

 

[alaskanpiper]

‘Here’s some more about JP-5 and JP-8. One of the things we have to be careful of is ship to shore and conversely shore to ship ops. The wrong gas refill means we can’t go to the boat. This is due to the flash point. It’s basically when fuel and vapor become volatile and can ignite. Some fuels have lower ones. We mandate higher flash points on the flight deck. Direct result of the USS Forrestal disaster in Vietnam.

JP-8 | High-quality jet fuel for military aviation use | Repsol - https://www.repsol.com/en/products-and-services/aviation/jp-8/index.cshtml

Very interesting. Thats the one thing that I’ve always been paranoid about with commercial travel and I assumed it would apply to military flight as well. A safe and succesfull flight is dependent on so many people doing their job correctly. There is some comfort in knowing I am the only one in control of every facet in private single engine flight (aside from ATC, my A&P, and traffic of course, haha).

It would be so uncomfortable to me to depend on someone else to ensure anything at all is done correctly before/during/after any flight.

I know they have very tried and true systems with very well trained people, but it still just gives me the heebee-geebees, haha.

 

[Akousticplyr]

Very interesting. Thats the one thing that I’ve always been paranoid about with commercial travel and I assumed it would apply to military flight as well. A safe and succesfull flight is dependent on so many people doing their job correctly. There is some comfort in knowing I am the only one in control of every facet in private single engine flight (aside from ATC, my A&P, and traffic of course, haha).

It would be so uncomfortable to me to depend on someone else to ensure anything at all is done correctly before/during/after any flight.

I know they have very tried and true systems with very well trained people, but it still just gives me the heebee-geebees, haha.

‘Haha. The fact that we do it so safely, day after day, millions of flight hours at a time is a testament to the professionalism in the aviation industry at all levels. It’s humbling to be a part of it.

 

[alaskanpiper]

‘Haha. The fact that we do it so safely, day after day, millions of flight hours at a time is a testament to the professionalism in the aviation industry at all levels. It’s humbling to be a part of it.

Amen to that. If you saw some of the carelessness we see on a daily basis in private flight in Alaska you’d probably puke for the rest of your life. Planes over gross, flying in shit weather, and a distinct lack of proficiency are common place here. Not to mention flying around without transmitters in congested airspace, planes out of annual, and 80 year old cowboy pilots that can’t hear shit. It’s shameful.

I always liked (and always remember) the one that hangs above the door of the cabin of the CFI that trained me for my private and float rating:

 

[olkofri]

never heard that before and would assume that is something that was already taken care of. I'd assume before this discussion that there would be systems in place to counter such things. My first gut feeling was it's a way to keep people from spreading germs.

That was my initial assumption as well, but once you take a pause to think it over, it makes sense: it's not unlike distributing the cargo on a ship to properly ballast it and preventing it from tipping over, specially in a rough sea.

 

[anotherbob]

I promise you it has little to do with germs. If any commercial pilots show up they will tell you that having passengers move for weight and balance when an aircraft is not full is very common practice and was implemented long before covid-19 showed up.

hence the first reaction statement.

 

[scloyd]

Thanks everyone. Great responses. I have flown on many flights and have never heard of this or really gave it any thought. Very interesting stuff. ?

 

[warren]

Former loadmaster here, weight and balance is important for a couple of reasons. If the pilot prefers "nose down" the "percent of mac" (basically the center of gravity for the aircraft when loaded) is moved to accommodate his desire. But, more important than pilot desires is simple air worthiness. If an aircraft is too far out of balance or over loaded it ceases to be air worthy.

Where the passengers are seated could be critical depending on the load in the belly. I wouldn't dismiss the pilot's instructions out of hand or through ignorance at any time.

 

[hoppes]

SEL, MEL, Instrument pilot flying for 50 Plus years. Every Aircraft from a glider to a 787 airliner has a design factor that determines the center of gravity and the center of lift. Each craft has a design limit for the distance between the two. If the center of gravity is ahead of the center of lift, the aircraft is nose heavy and the tail down force will not be strong enough to adequately raise the nose. If the center of gravity is behind the center of lift, the aircraft is tail heavy and becomes much harder to control. Every aircraft must keep the balance between those two limits to have adequate control. The airlines do the figuring sort of automatically. With light aircraft, it is the pilots responsibility to figure out the numbers by determining the weight of each object in the aircraft and it's moment arm. If one chooses to ignore the design factors, the laws of physics will always win no matter how great a pilot you think you are. Class dismissed ! Hoppes

 

[warren]

Now they've got computers. I had to use a "slide rule" type device to figure it out and match pilot desires. The young guys got it easy, the computer tells them the order of the pallets and where they are locked down.

 

[alaskanpiper]

Now they've got computers. I had to use a "slide rule" type device to figure it out and match pilot desires. The young guys got it easy, the computer tells them the order of the pallets and where they are locked down.

There are also apps that can run it for private pilots now, but I always do the hard calcs too, just to make sure they match.

I do however have my owners manual loaded on my phone. This allows me to mount my phone near the top of the instrument panel so I can complete my pre-flight checklist without having my face buried in my lap while taxiing on busy water. And yes, I have the hard copy in the cockpit as well, just in case, and to keep it legal.

Wish I could say the same for all Alaska private pilots. Many old timers out there, and for a lot of them their pre-flight consists of jamming the throttle in until the plane comes off the water.

 

[TinCup]

Its not just the weight/balance that others have described so ably (i've been aware of this for years as a run of the mill passenger on short haul flights)

The other reason they don't want you moving around is linked to why they always want you to wear your seat-belt when seated. If a plane crashes its much easier to ID the casualties if they are strapped in to their assigned seats & not halfway down the plane

 

[warren]

The FBI response team and lab still must get a proper ID and seating charts aren't it. It's one of the starting points but, it's not considered definitive.