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forciori

Starting to Get Obsessed
May 29, 2019
271
1,025
116
Brasil
pipedia.org
The desire to discredit me is so great, that the vision distorts and sees an "S" where it has a "C". Impressive!

You need glasses and a great deal of modesty... And not, I'm not "playing".

I'm out, permanently.
Thank you.
 
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forciori

Starting to Get Obsessed
May 29, 2019
271
1,025
116
Brasil
pipedia.org
I'd love to understand that rejection... Is it because I'm Latino? Is that why I'm not worthy of my pipes or is that why my word is worthless? I have done the best I can to have good pieces and share a bit about what I have learned, but it was never enough.
 
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dcon

Lifer
Mar 16, 2019
2,636
21,489
Jacksonville, FL
I'd love to understand that rejection... Is it because I'm Latino? Is that why I'm not worthy of my pipes or is that why my word is worthless? I have done the best I can to have good pieces and share a bit about what I have learned, but it was never enough.
forciori, I, for one, would hate to see you go. After years of lurking around here before joining a few years back, I would say that, perhaps you may be reacting in a little bit of a too sensitive matter. I do not believe that anyone posting was intentionally trying to “discredit” you. I, myself, hit like on the post questioning the stamping because that, is the way that I, as a truly neutral observer, saw it, as well. You might note that the stampings only appeared clear to some observers after magnification under a loop or after being technically enhanced.

I believe that your knowledge is a valuable asset to this forum and I enjoy your posts. As to peoples’ prejudices, I can only speak for myself and I am just intolerant or intolerance and ignorance.
 

ssjones

Moderator
Staff member
May 11, 2011
18,317
11,072
Maryland
postimg.cc
As mentioned, I was hoping to see pictures of the rest of the pipe. Your obviously have very good photography skills, that we've admired in the past. Take a better picture of that nomenclature please (camera phones zoomed in take amazing close-up shots). It almost appears that you are trying to hide something by choosing not to post decent photos, where they would absolutely remove any doubt of the pipes veracity.
 
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snagstangl

Lifer
Jul 1, 2013
1,606
768
Iowa, United States
Forciori, the rejection you speak of , or doubt for me comes from the amazing coincidences you state in the start of the thread. You describe how it seems almost impossible for this pipe to be made in the timelines you know of, but the stampings suggest you are correct.

I doubt your heritage or race has anything to do with the rejection or doubt. I had no idea until you stated previously, your ethnic background. I am not sure how others would have either to hold it against you. I have also started threads, posted pictures and been found to be categorically wrong about things here. In some cases I still think I am right, I just don't argue for to long to prove it to others. If you are sure, let that be enough.
 

Briar Baron

Can't Leave
Sep 30, 2016
440
569
Sydney
forciori, I think you are over-reacting and taking this too personally and as most members here know, there is much less racism here than in general society.

These questions and discussions from members are related to the pipe, not you. Taking it any other way and being offended and mentioning your race is frankly a bit of an insult to us.
 

laniromee

Starting to Get Obsessed
Jul 31, 2018
105
129
I'm really sorry if this post is too off-topic but I can't stay silent after how rude Forciori was. He is quite famous here in Brazil for all the wrong reasons.

He knows a little about Dunhill history and often boasts that he's internationally recognized for his knowledge and collection - And that's fine, I guess. But if he ever misjudges something or makes a mistake and those are pointed out, he gets really angry and defensive and will never humble himself in order to learn something new.

He enjoys fishing for compliments and praise but can't handle second-guessing or even a normal, rational discussion on any topic without getting offended for nothing at all. I've seen him delete posts in threads where he is proven wrong so that no one can ever find out he made a mistake. Big ego + reluctance to learn = very bad combo.

I was actually learning a lot from the debate in this thread, I never knew about "after hours" Dunhills and such, that was fascinating. But we got interrupted when Forciori reached a new low, accusing others of racism when that really has nothing to do with it. Well, I'm also from Brazil and was always treated with respect by everyone here so I'm deeply sorry you guys had to read Forciori's despicable outburst. Please don't think badly of Brazilians because of him as we're usually much nicer than that.
 
Oct 7, 2016
2,451
5,195
Forciori, the rejection you speak of , or doubt for me comes from the amazing coincidences you state in the start of the thread. You describe how it seems almost impossible for this pipe to be made in the timelines you know of, but the stampings suggest you are correct.

This.

I am no Dunhill expert, but as I said in my first post on the subject, their are anomalies about that pipe
beyond the spelling of one word in the nomenclature. I merely shared, with the benefit of limited personal experiences that were memorable to me because they came early on and served as a warning, some history of counterfeit Dunhills.

I never said one word about whether I thought the pipe was a genuine Dunhill works, produced in the normal course of business, piece or not. I am not expert enough to opine. I would not do so if I had the pipe in hand. But I saw many of the early 1980’s counterfeit Dunhills in hand, had knowledgeable collectors point out what was queer about them, and reread the Loring article before I said one word.

Based on that, I will say exactly what I thought when I first saw the pictures. That piece bears no resemblance to the 1980’s counterfeit Dunhills I saw. I But I never saw all of them, and rumors persisted for well,over a decade that more were made than ever surfaced in the US at that time.

It is still an anamoly. It is a spectacular piece from what I can see. I would love to see it in hand. Anamolies are not unheard of in Dunhill collecting, nor are disagreements.

And anything that is worth counterfeiting will be counterfeited. Were I still into Duhills, I would only buy it after getting some other opinions. And I might buy it in the face of other’s doubts, as did John Loring, to my personal knowledge, with a few pieces that he acquired after the1980’s fake “cat was out of the bag.”

@forciori, I could care less about your ethnicity or country of residence. If I read your OP correctly, this is not even your pipe , and you acknowledged the basic issues in your post. Why you are getting so upset?
 
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bluegrassbrian

Your Mom's Favorite Pipe Smoker
Aug 27, 2016
5,973
51,348
41
Louisville
I'm really sorry if this post is too off-topic but I can't stay silent after how rude Forciori was. He is quite famous here in Brazil for all the wrong reasons.

He knows a little about Dunhill history and often boasts that he's internationally recognized for his knowledge and collection - And that's fine, I guess. But if he ever misjudges something or makes a mistake and those are pointed out, he gets really angry and defensive and will never humble himself in order to learn something new.

He enjoys fishing for compliments and praise but can't handle second-guessing or even a normal, rational discussion on any topic without getting offended for nothing at all. I've seen him delete posts in threads where he is proven wrong so that no one can ever find out he made a mistake. Big ego + reluctance to learn = very bad combo.

I was actually learning a lot from the debate in this thread, I never knew about "after hours" Dunhills and such, that was fascinating. But we got interrupted when Forciori reached a new low, accusing others of racism when that really has nothing to do with it. Well, I'm also from Brazil and was always treated with respect by everyone here so I'm deeply sorry you guys had to read Forciori's despicable outburst. Please don't think badly of Brazilians because of him as we're usually much nicer than that.

Yes I’ve seen similar posts in fb groups from him where he expounds on Dunhill topics.

Its been my experience that the pipe collecting community is so much more mature, tactful, and interested in learning than many other hobby-groups. No group of humans is without its anomalies however lol.

Ive always has pleasant interactions with South Americans in general.. Brazilians, Peruvians, Chileans and so forth. Gus Cunha is a particular favorite of mine.
 

lightmybriar

Lifer
Mar 11, 2014
1,315
1,838
I'm really sorry if this post is too off-topic but I can't stay silent after how rude Forciori was. He is quite famous here in Brazil for all the wrong reasons.

He knows a little about Dunhill history and often boasts that he's internationally recognized for his knowledge and collection - And that's fine, I guess. But if he ever misjudges something or makes a mistake and those are pointed out, he gets really angry and defensive and will never humble himself in order to learn something new.

He enjoys fishing for compliments and praise but can't handle second-guessing or even a normal, rational discussion on any topic without getting offended for nothing at all. I've seen him delete posts in threads where he is proven wrong so that no one can ever find out he made a mistake. Big ego + reluctance to learn = very bad combo.

I was actually learning a lot from the debate in this thread, I never knew about "after hours" Dunhills and such, that was fascinating. But we got interrupted when Forciori reached a new low, accusing others of racism when that really has nothing to do with it. Well, I'm also from Brazil and was always treated with respect by everyone here so I'm deeply sorry you guys had to read Forciori's despicable outburst. Please don't think badly of Brazilians because of him as we're usually much nicer than that.
I have been corresponding with Mr. Forcióri daily for many months, as we both share a love of history and tobacciana. I do not wish to harp on this subject, but I do feel obligated to say that the person described in laniromee’s post is not the Forcióri I know and so I’d just like to make that known. He has always been very generous with his knowledge and time and I find him to be well-read, intelligent, and incredibly friendly.

Some of the misunderstandings he has had here are definitely due to a language barrier, and at the same time there are definite clashes of personalities. That being said, there’s no need for character assassination. One is free to not particularly care for someone, but we don’t have to totally discredit them or their contribution to the forum due to that.

I am not trying to change anyone’s mind or engage in any debate, I just felt obligated to say something on the positive regarding Mr. Forcióri since that has been my experience with him.
 
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