A Beginner's Pipes Cost $900

[sablebrush52]

Those endeavors are re-creative: taking somebody else's ideas and realizing them in whatever medium (sound, acting &c). Although the general intelligence level of those involved (conductors excepted) is notably high, you'll look long and hard for creativity among them.

Maybe with a symphony orchestra, but when I'm designing and/or painting backgrounds, providing visual development on a project, designing characters, participating in the creation of a new project, art directing, supervising visual effects, shooting plates and painting a matte painting, it feels pretty creative to me.
EDIT: Almost forgot the screenwriters and directors, who are also members of guilds as well. These are content creators.

 

[sablebrush52]

Producers and composers are also in guilds.

 

[sparrowhawk]

Sable, I'd love to see a real artist like you at work; for years I declined to call myself such because such utter frauds dominated (and continue to do so) the visual arts. I reluctantly started to use the term when my work got published. But I'm actually a writer.

 

[jefff]

Very little is ever really new, just a twist on what is already there.
Off the top of my head only Leo Fender with the Precision Bass and Steve Jobs with the iPhone, in recent years have given us something we needed before we knew we needed it.
And a pipe, or anything else is worth what someone will pay for it. And not a penny more.

 

[sablebrush52]

I do like C. S. Lewis. But he's expressing a point of view, not a fact. Language, it's meaning and usage, evolve over time to reflect that time. You feel me?
BTW, Rembrandt was a member of a guild as well.
The idea of the artist as a lone visionary, creating art for art's sake is a modern invention, a romantic one at that. Historically creatives like Michelangelo, Leonardo, Mozart, Bach, etc were either servants or commercial businessmen working on commission. If you happen to have a genius doing the work you get a Sistine ceiling or a Missa Solemnis. But these are most often commissioned work done at the behest or order of someone higher on the food chain, kind of like a modern motion picture studio. Bach wrote works of genius to meet his contractual obligations and once performed they were relegated to the shelf to be tossed into the trash by the next occupant.
Granted, Beethoven was one of the first to break the social definitions surrounding his profession and to perform public concerts on his own for the purpose of making money for himself. But it was still a commercial endeavor.
Wellington's Victory anyone?

 

[sablebrush52]

On topic, Beethoven with Prince Lichnowsky, DaVinci with Louis XII (and others like Michaelangelo) were not union guys working on the clock for contractors.

True. But if they had been they would have had far better working conditions and health insurance.

 

[sablebrush52]

Better than free lodging in palaces?

Michelangelo didn't get no free lodging, and he whined about the whole experience.

 

[music4cash]

Mozart was the one who really started breaking down the patron system...I'd much rather have a patron, than constantly scrounge around for commissions, a lot of the commercial guys now just put out descriptions of the music they want, and make all us poor jingle punks fight it out with submissions for the money...It sucks to spend 8 hours writing something only to have it rejected.

 

[lohengrin]

And then the cost of a pipe...

Oops! Sorry, I was thinking this was a pipe smokers forum!

 

[halfy]

I am so excited to see you fellas do talk about something in this thread :D Very pleasant to read.

 

[cosmicfolklore]

Hmmm... I'm gonna have to check ebay for a Mozart estate pipe now.
Or, should I join an artist union? Eh, I'm scared to google "artist union." My kids use my ipad sometimes. ::

 

[sablebrush52]

And then the cost of a pipe...

Oops! Sorry, I was thinking this was a pipe smokers forum!

It's occasionally a pipe smokers forum. But you know how it is when you get pipe smokers together, they can't stay on topic. What would be the fun of that?

 

[sablebrush52]

Hmmm... I'm gonna have to check ebay for a Mozart estate pipe now.

I haven't seen one of those in a long time.
You might get as much satisfaction from some Mozart chocolate.

 

[sablebrush52]

Sable, I'd love to see a real artist like you at work; for years I declined to call myself such because such utter frauds dominated (and continue to do so) the visual arts. I reluctantly started to use the term when my work got published. But I'm actually a writer.

You look like a real artist to me. More importantly to me, you look like a fine craftsman. You draw beautifully and imaginatively.
The term "artist" is one that gets used to the point where it has become as meaningless as C. S. Lewis claims the word "gentleman" has become. We apply it to just about everything. I use "artist" because it's the accepted descriptor in my line of work. It would be pretentious not to use it. But I always felt more comfortable with the term craftsman. That seems more connected to the activity involved, even when I'm inventing.

The idea of the "artist" has become divorced from the idea of the "craftsman". To my feeble mind, that's a bad thing.
But it does kind of explain $900 for a pipe maker whose work "...got the same problems like many newbie carvers, e.g. a tight mortise in dry season, not so well cured briar". Everyone loves a pretty face.
See how I got this back to the original topic?
Mark Rothko is a real artist.

 

[lohengrin]

Sabelbrush,

don't worry, I also like this kind of topics and it is a pleasure to read the clever opinions of persons like you and others.

When we start talking about art we risk to keep on talking and talking endlessly. Nothing wrong, but, since I like these things too much I fear not to have the time to read other topics!

 

[halfy]

He is making very decent pipes. And from this Dublin his ambition is obvious.