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I Need Help With This Comoy's.....Please

(41 posts)
  1. seadog

    seadog

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    I've been researching this Comoy's pipe for a couple weeks now, and have come up with zero. I've even contacted a few knowledgeable friends, who have even more knowledgeable contacts, and still....zero. What I have is a Comoy's Specimen Straight grain pipe. And from what I can find, a fairly rare pipe to begin with. The problem is that through all my research, I keep coming up with one constant, every single example of a Comoy's Specimen Straight Grain are all...straight Billiards. Different model#'s, but all are straight Billiards. The one I have is a Bent Billiard, model# 214 to be exact. This pipe is definitely pre-Cadogan, with the 3 piece insert on the stem, and my guess would be 1950's or 1960's. I'd like to sell this pipe, but I can't, because no one has ever seen a Bent Billiard Specimen Straight Grain. And if I can't determine it's value, I can't sell it....period. So any help would be greatly appreciated. This pipe has been restored/refinished (by me), as the original finish had dulled to a rather bland grey/brown color.



    Posted 2 years ago #
  2. dmcmtk

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    I'm not sure what the question is. That being said, what do you mean by re-finished? Was stain involved or does the pipe look so orange because of the lighting?

    Dave
    Duke Street Irregular
    Posted 2 years ago #
  3. seadog

    seadog

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    Well, if you think this pipe is orange, then you may want to check the settings on whatever image rendering software you're using, as this pipe is definitely NOT orange. And re-finishing means just that, the pipe has been refinished.
    LOL....and you're not sure what the question is???.....let me know when you figure it out.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  4. ssjones

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    This is one reference point, two sold at $1,950 - but one was had the additional Extraordinaire stamping and the other Blue Riband.

    But, not many bents are found (none?).

    One just recently sold, I remember seeing it.

    A guess would be around $250 or so.

    Al

    Posted 2 years ago #
  5. seadog

    seadog

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    Thank you Mr Jones. I was hoping you'd show up, as I knew you would be able to give me some general information and point me in the right direction. I was beginning to think this was a one-off pipe, simply because I could nothing to reference it.......thanks again.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  6. seadog

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    I mean.....duh......I could find nothing to reference it.....

    Posted 2 years ago #
  7. beefeater33

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    I'm not real clear on what the question is either?????
    Pricing?---- Just start the bidding on Ebay at .99 cents, and let the market decide?
    Rarity?---- They aren't common, but not extremely rare, a quick google search turned up a Quarter Bent Pear
    Another shape here: LOVAT
    And a seven day set, with lots of different shapes: 7 day set
    Other shapes besides straight billiards are out there. The value of the pipe would be what someone is willing to pay for the pipe..............

    "We are the music makers, and we are the dreamers of the dream..."
    Willy Wonka
    Posted 2 years ago #
  8. seadog

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    Well, at least Mr Jones understood the question, and to me, that's all that matters. And the 2 pipes you referenced are both straight pipes, as in... the shanks are straight not bent as in the photo of the pipe I have. And I'd never sell anything I own of quality on Ebay....never.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  9. ssjones

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    Good searching Beef, I didn't find that bent Pear. That (594) and the 215 referenced here are the only bents that can be found. I guess the briar wasn't conducive to a bent shape.

    Here's a 215 "Selected Straight Grain" that I restored a long time ago (ugh, I see some mistakes here).
    https://rebornpipes.com/2012/07/28/selected-straight-grain-comoys-restoration/

    The Selected Straight grains were really 2nds because of a flaw (the one above had a fill). They typically also didn't have the Comoy's stamp or C stem logo (but apparently some did). I wonder if they tried making bents but when the flaw(s) appeared, they were regularted to Selected Straight grain 2nd's status? Wow, this was back in 2013, perhaps one of my first restorations. Wish I had that one back again to do...

    Posted 2 years ago #
  10. dmcmtk

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    I'll ask the question again, was the pipe re-stained? And, yes, it may just be my monitor, or the lighting. I like the pipe, the shape of the stem is lovely. If the question is what is it worth, I'd say $200-$400. I might even say it being a bent might make it more attractive to a collector/buyer.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  11. jpmcwjr

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    Seadog- How did you refinish the pipe? Please try to answer without snark.

    I know that you believe you understood what you think I said, but I'm not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant.
    Posted 2 years ago #
  12. seadog

    seadog

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    dm - thanks for the update. I was thinking $300 for the pipe (btw - no fills or flaws in the briar on this one), but in all honesty, I couldn't offer it for sale without knowing, as I may have under priced it or over priced it. And by refinishing, yes, the original finish was dull and worn, so I sanded it down to bare wood and re-stained the briar....thanks again for your input, it is appreciated.

    jp - I sanded down the briar to bare wood (wet sanding with 320 grit wet/dry then wet sanding again with 400 grit wet/dry) and stained with Fiebings Light Brown. Funny thing I've learned about re-staining briar. I use Fiebings Light Brown on 90% of the pipes that I refinish, and the color is different on every pipe.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  13. seadog

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    Here's a couple of examples of other pipes I've stained with Fiebings Light Brown. The first is a Charatan I own:

    .....and another, which is an original Linkman's Dr Grabow I also own, same color, Light Brown:

    Posted 2 years ago #
  14. seadog

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    LMFAO.......is does keep your color options real simple when re-staining a pipe......oh....I know.....Fiebings Light Brown.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  15. dmcmtk

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    I sanded down the briar to bare wood (wet sanding with 320 grit wet/dry then wet sanding again with 400 grit wet/dry) and stained with Fiebings Light Brown.

    This answers my question, and now having seen the pipe before any work was done (the 16 Dec ebay listing) I would strongly recommend to NOT DO IT AGAIN. To do that to a pipe like that, to be brutally honest, makes its value plummet. With high grade English pipes, ORIGINALITY is key. Sorry, but that's the truth.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  16. doctorbob

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    I collect Comoy's, so take this as a collector's opinion. Pluses are high grade, good stamps, rare shape (not unique though, I had a SSG shape 13 at one point). Negative points are that the pipe has been refinished- this is huge to a collector, from the pictures it appears that the stem needs further work, the front outer rim might have been reshaped, and I wonder if the pipe has been over reamed in the past as it appears to lack the inner rim bevel that almost all post-war production had.

    I would suspect 200-300 would be a reasonable expectation. Comoy pipes have been in a bubble as of late and it is a good time to sell.

    Doc

    Posted 2 years ago #
  17. doctorbob

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    Going to check the eBay listing...

    Doc

    Posted 2 years ago #
  18. seadog

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    Considering that I've restored, refinished and sold any number of Comoy's, GBD's, Dunhill's, Charatan's and others. And each one sold for every penny of what they were worth, if not more. So at this point I WILL TOTALLY DISREGARD what you said and continue to do what I do. And as I value the opinion of Ken Barnes in reference to a couple of extremely rare Charatan pipes that I totally re-finished and re-stained, you can also take that for what it's worth. Sorry, but that's the truth.....

    Posted 2 years ago #
  19. seadog

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    Thanks for the input doc....again, the price range was pretty much what I was considering, just needed confirmation.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  20. ashdigger

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    Ubi Ignis Est?
    Posted 2 years ago #
  21. dmcmtk

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    Seadog, I have great respect for Ken's opinions. But with this pipe, I'm just not seeing it. What I am seeing is micro scratches all over the place, and a rather dull, almost satin finish (now again that could be the pictures), but one thing Comoy's was known for, was the finishes of their pipes. If you are going to sell it, best of luck...

    Posted 2 years ago #
  22. ssjones

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    I chose to only restain pipes that are either ruined beyond any collector value or have no real significance. I have only four stain colors (Med Brown is one). That really limits what can be done. Guys like George D I think have close to, or perhaps more than, 100 stain colors (he told me once, I forget the exact number). That allows them to restore the finish to a factory color, or at least very close. I can't pull that off.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  23. sablebrush52

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    When a pipe is heavily restored, as in restained, etc, the collector value is diminished. Simple as that. Ken knows this as well. Different manufacturers had their own methods for staining, giving their pipes a distinctive color or color effect through multiple contrast staining as with the Blue Riband. Once the history of an old pipe has been obliterated a lot of its interest and value goes as well. Serious collectors avoid botoxed pipes. We want the genuine article in the best possible condition and THAT'S what we are willing to pay for.

    That said, a lot of people just want a pretty pipe and are neither knowledgeable about, nor care, about what its original makers intended. That's an unpleasant fact for those of us who have a love for old pipes and their history. We are a tiny fraction of a tiny fraction of a tiny fraction.

    Based on the above thread, clearly you can't teach a seadog new thinking.

    BTW, I'm looking at these pipes on a professional grade color calibrated monitor and they all look pretty damned red-orange. It probably doesn't help that they've been stuck against a yellow ground, reflected light from which would throw off the color. Or maybe they're just pretty damned orange red.

    It is better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to open one's mouth and remove all doubt. - Mark Twain

    It is pointless to argue with a fanatic since a dim bulb can't be converted into a searchlight. - Jesse Silver
    Posted 2 years ago #
  24. pruss

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    Your pipes look orange/red.

    I also see scratches in the surface of the pipe, and a satin finish. Nomenclature has also taken a hit. Grain contrast has been lost in the refurb.

    Keep doing whatever you want, that's your prerogative. But when you ask for assistance, and are sarcastic and dismissive when someone asks you questions or poses an opinion you don't like maybe you need to re-evaluate if you want to have a dialogue at all.

    Shiny Pipes has proven that there is a market for folks who do what you do to pipes. Please, go compete with them.

    -- Pat

    Posted 2 years ago #
  25. sablebrush52

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    Shiny Pipes has proven that there is a market for folks who do what you do to pipes. Please, go compete with them.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  26. davet

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    So any help would be greatly appreciated.

    A short time later...

    So at this point I WILL TOTALLY DISREGARD what you said and continue to do what I do.

    So there you go

    Posted 2 years ago #
  27. ashdigger

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    Pat, with your Shiny Pipes reference, you win the Internet today.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  28. mso489

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    On Forums, you won't always learn what you'd like to learn, but if you read and consider, you can usually learn something.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  29. rhoadsie

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    Based on the thread responses, here you go...

    Posted 2 years ago #
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    jensen

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    My Comoys specimen Straight Grain shape 28 bought new in the early 70ties looks
    quite different in colour and finish than the one above.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  31. kenbarnes

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    Seadog:I personally would never strip and sand an old collectable pipe unless the customer brought it to us as a special request because he did not like the finish etc. I remember only one occasion when a collector managed to locate Barry Jones (after he left Charatan) and asked him to strip a Charatan Supreme in order to remove a large dent in the bowl. The collector knew that Barry could mix up the exact spirit stain that was used at Charatans. We both told the customer that we would not normally strip a pipe of its finish and if we were to go ahead with this it would be at the customer's risk. Barry explained that even sanding this Supreme with fine sandpaper could bring up a flaw in the pipe and Barry would not want to take responsibility for this. The customer agreed to take the risk and luckily Barry was able to remove the deep dent, whilst keeping the shape intact and finish this pipe to its original colour.
    This stripped Comoy, in my opinion, has devalued the pipe greatly to the true collector. I agree that some people do want the pipe looking like "new", but not the true collecting purist.
    This orange finish (and yes, I call it an orange finish)was not used, as far as I am aware, in the earlier days of pipe-making.
    I suppose that if a pipe like a Comoys Blue Riband which possibly had a stripped-off black background stain (which was initially applied and burnt in)and then possibly oil applied to the bowl, allowed to dry and then cleaned off with spirit/pure alcohol and then polished with fatty grey Carnauba wax, could, depending on that piece of briar, give a slightly orangey-type finish. However, it always depends on how the briar 'takes' the stain or applications.
    With help and guidance from people who use this Forum, I am learning so much and I want to remain 'forever teachable'.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  32. georged

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    Sorry to be late to the party. Just now saw this thread.

    Seadog, you'll have no problem selling that pipe as a tobacco access device.

    Serious Britwood collectors won't touch it as a collectable, though. The re-finish is ham-fisted and obvious (besides being a poor color choice), and the chamber looks to be significantly over-reamed and/or sanded. I'm also guessing that you wiped the pipe with some sort of oil before taking the pics, to try to cover the many multi-directional scratches on the stem as well as the bowl, and to create an "artificial gleam" of sorts. All in all, on the restoration scale, a 1.5 out of 10.

    As someone else suggested, putting it on Ebay with no minimum is your best option to sell it anytime soon. If re-listing it downward for the next six months is your idea of fun, though, start wherever you like.

    Dogs live such short lives... and spend most it waiting for us to come home
    Posted 2 years ago #
  33. pepesdad1

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    And there you have it.

    Sweet looking Comoy, though.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  34. mso489

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    Any pipe might be collectible to someone who happens to have such a collection. Certainly this fine Comoy could have been sold to a collector in its original condition. However, I think it's fair to just spiff up pipes that are aged and worn, to brighten them up as tobacco delivery systems as mentioned in the earlier post. People taking the trouble to restore or refurbish pipes should be aware of what they are doing and make good choices, for their own sakes financially and as crafts people. Nothing wrong with brightening up a worn pipe, but be aware of what you are doing. And of course, as a buyer, be aware of what you are buying.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  35. dmcmtk

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    All I can say, and I'M NOT trying to beat up on the OP, is this thread, and the comments within, should be read as a cautionary tale. For comparison, these are two before pictures of the pipe.


    Posted 2 years ago #
  36. simong

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    As someone who's favourite pipes are comoys, & who's spent a lot of money getting my collection of both older & cadogan made comoys. I wouldn't want that pipe even if it was a gift.
    An absolute abortion of a 'simple clean up job'. Such a shame, luckily there's plenty more out there for us comoy fans to spend our 2-300$ on!

    Posted 2 years ago #
  37. mayfair70

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    I prefer the original to the "refurb" in this case, for reasons already stated. Too bad, it was a lovely pipe.

    The secret of life is honesty and fair dealing. If you can fake that, you’ve got it made. -Groucho Marx
    Mouse-catcher on The Black Frigate
    Posted 2 years ago #
  38. davet

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    My wife and I have bought several pieces of antique furniture at very low prices because someone had refinished them. It's a shame some of them were beautiful before being stripped and refinishing attempted. That is what I get here from comparing the before and after pics

    P.S I went finer than 400 grit when I painted my lawn tractor.....

    Posted 2 years ago #
  39. peteguy

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    The satisfaction/happiness and sorrow/anguish of the rebornpipes readers.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  40. tschiraldi

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    I would have bought the "Before" pipe for $200.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  41. ssjones

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    I don't think there's much else to say here.

    Posted 2 years ago #

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