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Esoterica people

(195 posts)
  • Started 10 months ago by foursidedtriangle
  • Latest reply from brian64
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    foursidedtriangle

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    Maybe there is a chance someone from that company is reading this. You could consider an increase of your prices to $30 for 2oz and $80 for 8oz. It would accomplish two things, gives us mere mortals a chance to try your blends and secondly reduce the incentive (profit) from reselling your products.

    The community values your products at that price or higher, so the market has determined the price independently and you may as well benefit from it.

    Posted 10 months ago #
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    oldtoby

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    Well said. It's the scalpers who pull this overpriced crap.

    Posted 10 months ago #
  3. chasingembers

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    Well, the majority of us mere mortals don't rely on e-tailors for it. Call B&Ms, I get the tins for $14 and the bags for $30.

    I like coffee exceedingly.
    - H. P. Lovecraft
    Posted 10 months ago #
  4. jiminks

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    It won't work. The same people already paying more will just buy it all, and those who can't afford to pay more than the current prices will be effectively locked out forever. All your plan will do is enable the wealthier smokers to get it easier. And most likely, this would cause the prices on the secondary market to rise even further.

    Posted 10 months ago #
  5. beefeater33

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    Please mr. gas company, raise the price of gasoline! I want to pay more! And please mr. electric company, raise the price for my electricity! I want to pay more, so you good folks can make more profit!.........
    Please, Please... car manufacturers, raise your prices!!!! I WANT TO PAY MORE!!! I WAAAAANT TOOOOOOOOOOO PAAAAAAAAAY MOOOOOOOOOOOORE!!!...............
    Methinks there's a fool amongst us.........

    "We are the music makers, and we are the dreamers of the dream..."
    Willy Wonka
    Posted 10 months ago #
  6. sablebrush52

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    Call B&Ms

    +10,000

    I buy mine from B&M's. If you want to find Esoterica blends you will have to do the footwork. Eventually you will find what you're looking for. All this idea does is establish scalpers prices as the new retail. I have been patiently buying a bag here and a bag there over a number of years. I no longer have to chase it. If I can do it, so can you.

    It is better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to open one's mouth and remove all doubt. - Mark Twain

    It is pointless to argue with a fanatic since a dim bulb can't be converted into a searchlight. - Jesse Silver
    Posted 10 months ago #
  7. morgansteele

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    Esoterica makes fine tobaccos. But, there’s no reason to chase them down. There are so many fine blends out there that you can buy cheaply or in bulk. My Top 10 doesn’t include an Esoterica. The Germain blends are well crafted but the prices simply reflect scarcity. Save your money and buy: Maltese Falcon, Balkan Supreme, Sutliff 515, Squadron Leader, Peter Stokkebye’s LBF, LNF, or LTF, Boswel’s North woods, Sutliff ERR match, Orlik Golden Slice, Dark Bird’s Eye, Exotic Passion...

    Posted 10 months ago #
  8. chasingembers

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    I've built up all I'll ever need but will sometimes grab a bag of Pembroke for fun.

    Posted 10 months ago #
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    foursidedtriangle

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    I understand that some people have access to it or have a lot of it. I am speaking on behalf of people who do not have access to it nor will ever have access to it at below ebay price.

    Posted 10 months ago #
  10. sablebrush52

    sablebrush52

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    I am speaking on behalf of people who do not have access to it nor will ever have access to it at below ebay price.

    Simple answer. Pick up a phone and start calling B&Ms as soon as there's a sighting in the wild. No need to screw everyone.

    Posted 10 months ago #
  11. pianopuffer

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    I've got a few tins FS on the site. I realize they aren't as cheap as embers has found, but I figured I would grab them at the local B&M in case anyone wanted them. Not making any profit on these, but thought I could help out the fellow members who did hunt for this stuff.

    Posted 10 months ago #
  12. tschiraldi

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    PM sent

    Posted 10 months ago #
  13. mikefu

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    My local B&M does a good job of getting them in somewhat regularly. $13 for tins and $35 per bag. My checking with them every other week or so has led to a few pounds in my cellar. Just find a place to start a relationship with, and keep chatting and going back. After a while, the stars will align and you’re bound to get some.

    Posted 10 months ago #
  14. jpmcwjr

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    I've got a few tins FS on the site. I realize they aren't as cheap as embers has found, but I figured I would grab them at the local B&M in case anyone wanted them. Not making any profit on these, but thought I could help out the fellow members who did hunt for this stuff.

    Your B+M is selling Margate tins @ $45.00?? Good Lord.

    I know that you believe you understood what you think I said, but I'm not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant.
    Posted 10 months ago #
  15. pianopuffer

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    jpm - no, but I was including shipping in the orders. They still weren't cheap but I figured I was helping out the members.

    Posted 10 months ago #
  16. btp79

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    jpm - no, but I was including shipping in the orders. They still weren't cheap but I figured I was helping out the members.

    You also said you misjudged the market and dropped your price $10 per tin....

    Posted 10 months ago #
  17. cosmicfolklore

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    If you are willing to pay more money, why not just buy from the scalpers? Let those of us who have developed relationships with out B&Ms and have done the work alone.

    Michael
    Posted 10 months ago #
  18. hoosierpipeguy

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    jpm - no, but I was including shipping in the orders. They still weren't cheap but I figured I was helping out the members.

    One word. Bullshit.

    Posted 10 months ago #
  19. eggrollpiper

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    Yes, in NY because the tax is so high the bags go for minimum $70, at least at the one store in the entire county and next county that has them..

    Posted 10 months ago #
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    tkcolo

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    Beafeater33 that is harsh. I don't agree with OP, but I understand his logic. The general resale market is crazy for many blends. I wonder why the manufacturer hasn't capitalized on it. We complain about how the hobby is dying, stores are closing, framers are switching crops and producers are quitting. Yet I still buy online for $2/oz instead of paying $7/oz at a B&M. I justify it because my "local" B&M is 3 hours away, but I am part of the problem. Cigar guys pay 6 times what we do for similar quality.

    When I dipped, I spent $2000/yr on Copenhagen. I spent a fair amount building a cellar and a pipe collection, but I only really smoke $200/yr in tobacco. I can see why parts of the supply chain are leaving. I'd love to grow it myself, but if I had to make a living at growing and selling quality pipe tobacco, my end price would have to be higher than $2/oz.

    As an ag producer, we sell a lot of finished steers, hogs and sheep directly to individual buyers. (We take them to the local butcher and coordinate the delivery of the meat.) Buyers get a far superior product, much, much cheaper than buying grocery store meat. It's not even close. And we make a lot more than just selling to a feedlot, like normal producers. The markup from middle men is crazy. I'd rather not ever sell a steer to a feedlot again. It holds for tobacco too.

    You guys that have good B&M's, been around long enough to know affordable Esoterica, or have good cellars are in a different place than OP. Someone sell that man some Esoterica!

    Posted 10 months ago #
  21. mikefu

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    [quote]Let those of us who have developed relationships with our B&Ms and have done the work alone.

    Well said!

    Posted 10 months ago #
  22. warren

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    Well said. It's the scalpers who pull this overpriced crap.

    You are blaming the wrong end of the food chain. No customers, no "scalpers."

    A man without a shillelagh is a man without an expedient.
    Posted 10 months ago #
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    oldgeezersmoker

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    CupoJoes, Top Hat and Mars have all, in the last 7-10 days, had deliveries of ET that were available on their web pages for several hours at least. When I came in yesterday from some errands,there was an email from a friend of mine that said Pelican was in stock at Pipes and Cigars. The email was 3 hours old and it was still available. Penzance and Stonehaven can be hard to find, and no one that I know who chases the product will turn them down, so they go in a heartbeat. But if Germains prodeuct in general was ever hard to find at an on line etailer, it isn't now.

    Posted 10 months ago #
  24. dmcmtk

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    When I came in yesterday from some errands,there was an email from a friend of mine that said Pelican was in stock at Pipes and Cigars. The email was 3 hours old and it was still available.

    How very interesting. I haven't tried thr latest iteration of Pelican......yet.

    Dave
    Duke Street Irregular
    Posted 10 months ago #
  25. brian64

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    Cigar guys pay 6 times what we do for similar quality.

    Sure, but that's due to the labor costs involved. With pipes you have the added cost of the pipe itself...and the pipe smoker is doing the "labor" with the whole process involved...including caring for the pipes.

    So it only makes sense that premium pipe tobacco would be significantly less expensive than premium cigars.

    “Bipartisan usually means some larger-than-usual deception is being carried out.” – George Carlin
    Posted 10 months ago #
  26. pianopuffer

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    Cosmic- I bought from the B&M as I’d prefer to support the retailer than a scalper selling secondhand. I hear about people finding hard to get stuff and making it available for others that are interested, so I was attempting to do the same.

    Hoosier- it’s completely fine if you choose not to believe me, but I don’t appreciate being called a liar. Keep the negative comments to yourself, please.

    Posted 10 months ago #
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    tkcolo

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    Pelican is still available on P&C. One tin/customer. Resellers selling those same tins for $65 on ebay. I hate that.

    Posted 10 months ago #
  28. pianopuffer

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    Tkcolo- is the Pelican all it’s cracked up to be? I’ve heard the tin art is better than the tobacco...

    Posted 10 months ago #
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    tkcolo

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    I've never had it. Fairly mixed reviews on tobaccoreviews. I made the comment because It was the first time I have seen it available.

    Posted 10 months ago #
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    oldgeezersmoker

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    The labeling on the last tin of Pelican I had in my hand said Arango, not Butera. But otherwise, no change to the product that I can tell. This can be very confusing, as it has been made by several different companies over the years, and tobacco reviews lumps the reviews together from Germains, McClelland, Stokiebye and Germain again. All that I have had recently (purchased from shops in 2017 and 2018) has borne a Jersey island (Germain) origin statement.

    The only problem I have with it is that it doesn't last.

    Posted 10 months ago #
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    robcapp

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    I am speaking on behalf of people who do not have access to it nor will ever have access to it at below ebay price.

    If you want it to cost more from the manufacturer / retailer.... Then it sounds like you are comfortable with the price the secondary market charges - so just buy it there. Let us people getting it current prices do so.

    Your logic is flawed... You want It to cost more so that it is more readily available to more people.... But it is already readily available at the premium price you say that you're happy to pay.

    Posted 10 months ago #
  32. blackadderlxx

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    You are blaming the wrong end of the food chain. No customers, no "scalpers."

    This. I will never pay a flipper or someone who is "helping out the community" at 200% plus. Another board I'm on makes a point to draw...naughty bits on all of their Eso tins when they sell to someone in the community for a reasonable rate to stop flippers.

    Would I like to try (any) Esoterica blends? Sure. But I'm not going to play the crazy games when there's plenty of good blends out there.

    Posted 10 months ago #
  33. brian64

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    Your logic is flawed... You want It to cost more so that it is more readily available to more people.... But it is already readily available at the premium price you say that you're happy to pay.

    Perhaps this is actually just a clever ploy of the scalpers...just think how much greater the perceived value would be if the retail price was jacked up.

    Posted 10 months ago #
  34. krizzose

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    While I am certainly curious, I’m also happy having never tried any of their products. Ignorance (and a marketplace full of other stuff that I really like) is bliss

    Posted 10 months ago #
  35. chasingembers

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    You guys that have good B&M's, been around long enough to know affordable Esoterica, or have good cellars are in a different place than OP. Someone sell that man some Esoterica!

    Why? I'm supposed to search for a while to find it to sell to someone who's not willing to do the same? There's a pipe store locator at the top of this page. Start calling and it can be found.

    Posted 10 months ago #
  36. hoosierpipeguy

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    Hoosier- it’s completely fine if you choose not to believe me, but I don’t appreciate being called a liar. Keep the negative comments to yourself, please.

    I don't need to call you a liar. Your post in the for sales tells the story.

    Posted 10 months ago #
  37. bluto

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    There isn't a brick and mortar tobacco store within 1000 miles of me

    Online is all I got

    “listen: there’s a hell
    of a good universe next door; let’s go”
    Posted 10 months ago #
  38. chasingembers

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    You don't have to go there. Most of them ship.

    Posted 10 months ago #
  39. bluto

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    Ah yes , but dropping by and putting a face to the name seems to be the trick ..

    Posted 10 months ago #
  40. chasingembers

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    Not really. Most of mine came from miles away from sellers that have never seen my face. They're just interested in moving product.

    Posted 10 months ago #
  41. woodsroad

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    I am speaking on behalf of people who...
    This is the first warning sign: Someone who assumes to speak for others, with absolutely zero authority to do so.

    Posted 10 months ago #
  42. mikefu

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    Bluto- where do you live, if you don’t mind my asking?

    Posted 10 months ago #
  43. bluto

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    As Far East on the North American land continent as one can get and still stay dry

    Posted 10 months ago #
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    robcapp

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    I don't even live in the USA... And I pay retail prices for Esoterica... And no, I don't have to work to hard to find it.

    Posted 10 months ago #
  45. mikefu

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    Bluto- Wow. You’re not kidding about your options.

    Posted 10 months ago #
  46. brian64

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    This is the first warning sign: Someone who assumes to speak for others, with absolutely zero authority to do so.

    Actually that was the second warning sign...the first was a triangle with four sides.

    As Far East on the North American land continent as one can get and still stay dry

    There used to be a good B&M just a little east of you, but it went under. (sorry, I know...bad joke)

    Posted 10 months ago #
  47. sablebrush52

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    Why? I'm supposed to search for a while to find it to sell to someone who's not willing to do the same? There's a pipe store locator at the top of this page. Start calling and it can be found.

    +1000

    There isn't a brick and mortar tobacco store within 1000 miles of me

    Online is all I got

    That's about how far away my sources are. Los Angeles is a veritable desert for pipe tobacco. Cigars? You can get anything.

    Just made a phone call and picked up 1 lb of Dunbar to send to a friend. And, I'm not paying any freaking $80-$100 bucks a bag to do that. I don't get Embers' prices, but I don't pay all that much more, and it's considerably less than Pipes & Cigars is charging.

    If smoking these blends matters to you, you can make an effort to find sources, or hope to win the online lottery. But sitting around complaining is pointless when you can do something about it.

    And for those of you who think I should just post my sources, forget about it. For one thing, they've asked me not to do that. They don't want to be nagged. For another, they sell to me because I buy a variety of blends from them, not just cherry picking Esoterica. I've built up a regular customer relationship with them. Yes, I pay more for some tobaccos, but I also get access to hard to find stuff.

    Posted 10 months ago #
  48. chasingembers

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    And for those of you who think I should just post my sources, forget about it.

    +1000

    And well you shouldn't. Like me it probably took some time to find them and all it took was picking up a phone. If someone is willing to pay many times what it's worth, why not call around and find it for a fraction of the price.

    Posted 10 months ago #
  49. haparnold

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    And for those of you who think I should just post my sources, forget about it. For one thing, they've asked me not to do that. They don't want to be nagged. For another, they sell to me because I buy a variety of blends from them, not just cherry picking Esoterica. I've built up a regular customer relationship with them. Yes, I pay more for some tobaccos, but I also get access to hard to find stuff.

    This. This whole thing is all about relationships. Do I hate paying $14 for a tin of Orlik Golden Sliced at my B&M? Absolutely. But I really like when that same B&M calls me to tell me Esoterica is in stock and they're holding favorites for me until I come in again.

    Now, the economist is me wants to turn this into a discussion about price theory, but that's a tobacco talk for another day.

    De Gustibus Non Est Disputandum
    Posted 10 months ago #
  50. danielplainview

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    I don’t even bother with online sites. I know a guy who knows a guy. I chase one esoterica blend. You fellas can have the rest. Stonehaven tastes like mail pouch chewing tobacco to me. GLP and Bengals are far better than Penzance imo.

    Make aromatics great again.
    Posted 10 months ago #
  51. chasingembers

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    Yeah, I get the occasional Penzance for blending and Stonehaven rubbed me the wrong way. Pembroke and Dunbar are my cellar favorites though I've got a bit of all of them. I like Presbyterian much more than Penzance.

    Posted 10 months ago #
  52. peckinpahhombre

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    I get all my esoterica blends from woodsroad and I pay him $10 a bag. Just send him a PM and he will cut you the same deal.

    Posted 10 months ago #
  53. jaytex969

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    I found Esoterica HERE. Under $10 and free shipping!

    You're welcome, amigos...

    Gunner, Black Frigate. Say "Hello" to my little friend!
    Posted 10 months ago #
  54. chasingembers

    chasingembers

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    Or if you know a guy with horses you can bag your own.

    Posted 10 months ago #
  55. jaytex969

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    Do different breeds produce the different blends?

    Are flakes from constipated horses?

    Inquiring minds, and all...

    Posted 10 months ago #
  56. chasingembers

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    Damnit Jay I just blew coffee out my nose!

    Posted 10 months ago #
  57. warren

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    I drive 1400 miles roundtrip when I need to stock up on HP Sauce. I want it, I have to go where it is. Closest place is in Canada. I believe it is the one and only item Amazon doesn't carry. The drive is nice also. If you want a blend bad enough, do the work ... drive, check the internet, call ... just do what is necessary. But, asking for higher prices for everyone, is well ... an inanity!

    Four sided triangles? Raise prices to insure availability? Speaking for the, maybe 12 people on this board who can't find the blend?

    There used to be a good B&M just a little east of you, but it went under.

    Actually well played brian!

    Actually just a short, day-trip, by punt or rowboat to JJ Foxes.

    Posted 10 months ago #
  58. haparnold

    Hap

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    But, asking for higher prices for everyone, is well ... an inanity!

    Not exactly. It certainly is a stinker if you can already get Esoterica/unobtanium/whatever. But it's a decent theory. When demand outstrips supply by this much, the natural course is for price to rise so that demand equals supply. I've often wondered why people making highly desirable tobaccos don't charge more for them.

    One of the fundamental facts of human society is that the value of something is what people are willing to pay for it, and value is not always the same as price.

    Posted 10 months ago #
  59. bluto

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    I drive 1400 miles roundtrip when I need to stock up on HP Sauce. I want it, I have to go where it is. Closest place is in Canada.

    It's nothing more than tamarinds and raisins in tomato paste . Sorta like a homemade BBQ or pad Thai sauce . Try making it .

    Posted 10 months ago #
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    tkcolo

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    I've called several B&M's to ask them if they had Eso is stock, and they seemed perturbed to take the call. Maybe it was just my imagination. The annoyed voice on the other end made me think they were really telling me to come in and find out. They weren't going to tell me if they did have it. They were going to save it for their regular customers that bought everything else from them. That is what I would do anyway. So was that my imagination?

    Anyway I ended up finding most of their blends, and nothing really tripped my trigger. I stop by any B&M I can whenever I am in town and make it a point to buy tins and talk to the owner.

    Posted 10 months ago #
  61. peckinpahhombre

    peckinpahhombre

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    I drive 1400 miles roundtrip when I need to stock up on HP Sauce.

    Warren, HP sauce is sold everywhere here in Canada. Just PM me man and I will put a few bottles into the mail and send it to you. I love the stuff too.

    Posted 10 months ago #
  62. warren

    warren

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    True but, the manufacturer is obviously happy with the return his/her business model provides or, possibly is operating at capacity. Perhaps the maker enjoys the angst among those not finding the product.

    I still stand by the "inanity" as a few complaints on a small board hardly translates a clarion call for a price bump. Seems most who want the product are able to fill their needs without turning to "scalpers". Jack the price by a few bucks and the fiscally astute who are making money already will simply raise their "scalper" price. Raise the retail price a bit too much and Esoterica buyers might just turn other blends. It's all a risk only for the manufacturer. Our fellow members risk nothing.

    Perhaps those not willing to do the work shouldn't enjoy those particular blends.

    Posted 10 months ago #
  63. peckinpahhombre

    peckinpahhombre

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    tkcolo you need to build up a relationship with the B&M. They want to know that you're not just there (or calling) to find the good stuff. Buy a case of Captain Black Grape first and that will help build some credibility.

    Posted 10 months ago #
  64. bluto

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    Find a good chef quality steak sauce recipe , it's not difficult and it jars well.

    Trust me , it's gonna blow hp out of the pond , I make mine with a little rye whisky ..

    Posted 10 months ago #
  65. woodsroad

    woodsroad

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    I get all my esoterica blends from woodsroad and I pay him $10 a bag.
    C'mon, Peck. That deal was only for you. Anyone else would know immediately that I was refilling Stonehaven bags with Capt. Black Grape.

    Posted 10 months ago #
  66. lordofthepiperings

    lordofthepiperings

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    I gave up on the Esoterica blends years ago. There are so many blends on the market that are just as good if not better and are far more easy to obtain.

    "The thinking man always smokes a Peterson." -Peterson of Dublin
    Posted 10 months ago #
  67. sablebrush52

    sablebrush52

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    I've called several B&M's to ask them if they had Eso is stock, and they seemed perturbed to take the call. Maybe it was just my imagination. The annoyed voice on the other end made me think they were really telling me to come in and find out. They weren't going to tell me if they did have it. They were going to save it for their regular customers that bought everything else from them. That is what I would do anyway. So was that my imagination?

    Possibly. My sources hate cherry pickers and will not sell to them. If you call and ask for several blends that you're looking for, along with the Esoterica, they will be more likely to deal with you. And if they have some of those blends in stock, but not the Esoterica, buy the other blends anyway. Be a regular customer. Eventually they will come to recognize you and treat you like a regular customer. My sources actually know what I've bought in the past. My calls are like what a visit to my local B&M used to be when they stocked pipe tobaccos. We chat on the phone about this and that. I buy a few tins that I want, and maybe a bag or two if it's in. I'm never a pig about it.

    Posted 10 months ago #
  68. brian64

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    Damnit Jay I just blew coffee out my nose!

    I thought everyone retrohaled their coffee.

    Buy a case of Captain Black Grape first and that will help build some credibility.

    Suddenly lacking credibility doesn't seem so bad after all.

    Posted 10 months ago #
  69. kola

    kola

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    I love my pimp scalpers. They get me my Penzance fix. My name is Kola and I'm a Penzaholic.

    I treat people the way they treat me. It's that simple.
    Posted 10 months ago #
  70. chasingembers

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    Anyone else would know immediately that I was refilling Stonehaven bags with Capt. Black Grape.

    Replacing Stonehaven with something smokable.

    Posted 10 months ago #

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