Sable OK?

[deathmetal]

http://pipesmagazine.com/forums/profile/sablebrush52
He seems quiet of late. This leaves me as one of the few real cut-ups around here, and it's straining my back. Also I think he'll be a Royal Yacht convert one of these days.

 

[jefff]

I hope he is well... Or at least ok

 

[iamn8]

Speed Metal, Straining your back? Welcome to the jungle baby!!

 

[deathmetal]

Do I get to be doom metal at least once? What about NWOBHM?

 

[iamn8]

I'm afraid not yet, Gothic metal, but I'm sure we'll get there in time

 

[ravkesef]

He went quiet after a rather stupid and bigoted person used the forum to spout his racist ideology, and other forum members praised the thread for demonstrating the forum's inherent diversity, and moderators failed to remove this imbecile (I use the word as an expression of praise in this instance,) from the forum.

 

[deathmetal]

Too bad. I like his contributions. I also think there's a value in disagreeing with people without calling them idiots or equivalents. In that thread, for example, Sable's approach was generally to call bulls--t on the arguments without attacking the user. An example for us all.

 

[ravkesef]

If you can say that, then you clearly missed Jesse's point, the pain and anguish he felt, and completely missed the racism inherent in the OP's piece of trash, and failed to notice why Jesse isn't here. And yes, I did obtain Jesse's permission before posting.

 

[deathmetal]

Let's see... I started out on dial-up BBSes, and I've dealt with a lot of difficult situations.
This is a better way.

 

[ravkesef]

What is a better way? I'm not sure I understand what the better way is. Are you comfortable with someone using the N-word on this forum? Or anywhere else for that matter? Is that your idea of a better way? It isn't Jesse's, and that's why he chose a better way. He's not a racist and doesn't associate with them, nor hang out in any of the places they do. I completely missed the thread, else I, too, might be gone.

 

[deathmetal]

I say let anybody say what they want, if they do it politely, and then let it be debated.
I think the debate ended conclusively.
There are some issues on which there will be no agreement.

 

[ravkesef]

1. There is no "polite" way to express racism.
2. Yes, it ended conclusively. A valuable, much-loved member felt unwelcome, and left the forum.
3. Finally, something on which we can agree. Look, you started this thread, and when I told you what was going on, you didn't like it.

 

[deathmetal]

I think you're misreading. I'm glad to know what's going on, but I think this forum handled the issue well. My response has entirely been in response to your antagonism. I miss Sable and wish he'd come back, but I value a free speech community also

 

[mayfair70]

That's too bad. I wish him well and hope he comes back. Seems I need to pay closer attention.

 

[deathmetal]

I've done this for thirty years. The only way to deal with controversial minority viewpoints is to allow them to be politely aired, then let people respond, and if no interest, let it lapse. Cracking down merely legitimizes the antagonistic viewpoint and makes other people afraid to talk about other topics. This is simple logic and experience talking.
That is how you keep a civil AND open forum.

 

[ravkesef]

Thanks--I understand it much better now. It's all Sable's fault. Appreciate your calling that to my attention.

 

[deathmetal]

I don't think it's anyone's fault. People disagree. We either permit that, or become the monsters we claim not to be.

 

[mayfair70]

Damn. This really bothers me. I'm just the kind of idiot to praise diversity right after a post gets yanked and not realize by others comments that some heavy stuff just went down. This sucks.

 

[warren]

There are ways of expressing one's bigoted beliefs without being impolite. But, this is not a forum to be used for baiting, inciting or name calling.
The thread was going in an unacceptable direction. Hopefully a mod contacted those at fault, they were painfully obvious, and admonished them.
"To argue or debate with an idiot is, in and of itself, idiotic." -- W. Suddock 5/1/2016

 

[gloucesterman]

There is no justification for bigotry. When that is expressed at the expense others it is unacceptable under any circumstances. Trite excuses for toleration are just that. A highly revered and consistent contributor was offended by commentary that was both unnecessary and clearly insulting. If you can find justification for that kind of conduct, I cannot. It's intellectualism run amuck. Basic human decency demands that we all have consideration for the feelings of others. I for one morn the loss of a valued contributor because someone chose not to be considerate.