Peterson experts needed

[hoppes]

My second post on this forum! A friend of mine gave me a box of his old pipes that were thrown into the cold damp basement about twenty years ago. Unfortunately my dear friend also never cleaned or took care of his pipes ! This was a sorry looking specimen---the rim was chipped,the silver band was so black one couldn't tell if it were even metal,the mouthpiece was a color of green-yellow moss and any markings were obscured by a black coating of gunk. After some cleaning with Murphy's soap,I could tell it was a Peterson and had a silver band. Overlooking the obvious junk and marks, the briar pattern and shape of the pipe looked as if it might be saveable.Don't have before pictures but here are some after ones. The stem is marked Peterson's with Sterling underneath. The silver band has the K&P mark on top,Sterling Silver,Peterson, Dublin.The marks on the right side are almost gone. With 20 power loupe I can make out, in the form of a circle " Made in ---land" and the number 406. I assume this pipe is from the early sixties from what I can learn on the Internet, but any help from the experts would be appreciated. Thanks so much! Hoppes

 

[tschiraldi]

No "Irish Free State" stamp. I'm no expert, but I believe the pipe to be much newer than that. The older ones are often referred to as "Pre-Republic". Still, it turned out to be a beautiful Pete! It should be a good, solid pipe for you.
Tim

 

[rblood]

Per Jim Lilly's blog, made in Ireland in circle format is mid 1940s.
See his dating guide here
http://thepetersoncollector.blogspot.com/2010/07/welcome-to-my-new-blog.html?m=1

 

[dread]

Figure what'd date the symbols in the roll marked silver band represent, and that is when the pipe was made. But it sounds like rblood has you narrowed down pretty well. Nice pipe, btw.

 

[dread]

Looks like 1957 (?) according to this hallmark guide - the last symbol is the date symbol.
http://www.pipephil.eu/logos/en/infos/hallmark-dublin.html

 

[fitzy]

Great find!

 

[drennan]

Looks like 1957 (?) according to this hallmark guide - the last symbol is the date symbol.

The K&P aren't the hallmark, it's just a mark by Peterson that harks back to Kapp & Peterson.
There isn't a picture of the hallmark, if there's a hallmark it would date it fairly accurately

 

[dmcmtk]

The pipe dates from the period 1945-47, so a pre-Republic pipe.

With 20 power loupe I can make out, in the form of a circle " Made in ---land"

What you are seeing is the MADE IN IRELAND mark.

The country of manufacture stamp changed from "Made in Eire" to "Made in Ireland" (In circle) about 1945. Later (1947-49) it became "MADE IN IRELAND" (block letters) stamped in one or two lines.

The STERLING was a line of pipes. There are no dating hallmarks, the K & P mark is the Kapp & Peterson mark.

 

[dread]

The K&P aren't the hallmark, it's just a mark by Peterson that harks back to Kapp & Peterson.

Well, that explaines why all my banded Pete's were made in 1957. :rofl:

 

[tschiraldi]

Well, there you go! Like I said, I'm no expert. Great info, guys!

 

[ssjones]

Yes, those are "faux" hallmarks, simply brand stamps.
"Sterling" pipes that do not have hallmark date stamps were exported to the US for sale here (where hallmarks aren't required)
The 406 is a wonderful shape and that one is in good shape, nice work!

 

[jpmcwjr]

"Sterling" pipes that do not have hallmark date stamps were exported to the US for sale here (where hallmarks aren't required)

Could that be strictly an Irish thing? I thought all English sterling had to be hallmarked whether it was for domestic markets or export. Then again it wouldn't be the first time I've thought wrong.

 

[dread]

Then again it wouldn't be the first time I've thought wrong.

Hey, at least you didn't date the brand name "hallmark".

 

[paulfg]

there was /is? no requirement to hallmark silver exported to USA, only marked as silver or sterling silver as Al stated

 

[ssjones]

I first encountered this type of pipe with this 999, detailed here:

http://pipesmagazine.com/forums/topic/peterson-rocky-donegal-999-trade-wdave
I contacted Mark Irwin, who is writing the soon to be released book on Peterson. He helped me with a date range on that pipe, as it also lacked hallmarks. That one came with the box and Peterson brochure, which were all helpful in narrowing down a production date.

I sent Mark some pictures of the pipe, box and pamphlet. As mentioned, the puzzling thing about the pipe is the band is marked Sterling Silver, but has no dating hallmarks. Mark said the pipe is a Rogers import pipe which were distributed only in the US. The date hallmarks, required in Ireland, weren’t required here. According to Mark, the pamphlet was introduced in 1955 and the box design was used until 1961, when it was changed. So, Mark says the pipe is definitely from the ’55 – ’61 era. He suspects due to the stinger design in the late 50’s, but he has nothing concrete to back up that hunch. ’55 to ’61 is close enough for me. I shared this with Chuck W and he agrees with Mark. Mark added this was a “Sterling” line of US Petersons, and he doesn't encounter many, certainly not in that nearly unsmoked condition. Having the box and Peterson pamphlet to help date the pipe were certainly rare and important factors.