Loewe Haymarket Query

[Ahi Ka]

So I’m going to clean up an L&Co Birmingham for a friend and am a bit puzzled.

Im aware that they produced seconds (or for american market) during the Haymarket era under the Haymarket make with 2 digit numbers. This pipe is battered, but I can’t see any apparent fills or blemishes that may have downgraded it at time of manufacturing

this pipe is marked

LH side

L&Co
Haymarket

RH side
Loewe
(Can’t see any second line but could be buffed off I guess)

Bottom
Birmingham

It has a stinger, no step in on the tenon and no marking on the stem. The feel of the vulcanite is much closer to that of my other pre 20s pipes, however there is no orific button

interestingly, while not being able to assist with dating, a previous owner has etched the dates 29/10/23 and 10.7.24 into the side of the bowl

Any help in placing this one in a era? My main confusion is how Haymarket is located in the position of late civic era series lines, yet there are no model numbers. Also the stinger style seems like something that wouldn’t be used that late in the game either. My gut says 30s.

here’s some pics. Cheers

 

[ashdigger]

Interesting. The bit looks like the 30’s on. None of mine look like the cheap slot drug store pipes. I realize it’s secondary market, maybe Frankenpipe?

 

[Ahi Ka]

Also after posting the pics I caught a glimpse of a letter under Loewe and went back to examine pipe in sunlight. At a certain angle I can begin to make out something, first word is definitely ‘London’ so I’m assuming ‘w’ would follow it.

 

[Ahi Ka]

Interesting. The bit looks like the 30’s on. None of mine look like the cheap slot drug store pipes. I realize it’s secondary market, maybe Frankenpipe?

I feel like it is original stem or a replacement made for the pipe. Just realised in the pics I needed to turn stem an extra twist (the scratches help line it up. Lol). But the transition is smooth. The bit is quite similar to the 40s-50s Loewe I have played around with. The feel of the vulcanite however on this pipe seems better quality (well to my preference which are orific buttons) than the other pipes I have on my rack from mid century.

 

[bottils]

Based on the stamping and pictures, I'd say this is a first grade pre-Civic Loewe. "Birmingham" would indicate the model/shape and not a second grade pipe. Stinger system and no fills would back that up I think.

The dates carved into it also would indicate pre-ww2.

Nice pipe

 

[Ahi Ka]

Based on the stamping and pictures, I'd say this is a first grade pre-Civic Loewe. "Birmingham" would indicate the model/shape and not a second grade pipe. Stinger system and no fills would back that up I think.

The dates carved into it also would indicate pre-ww2.

Nice pipe

My thoughts exactly, however the “Haymarket” stamp under the L&Co logo is what has thrown me, especially as it’s located where the series lines went. If this wasn’t there I’d have no issues placing it in the middle Haymarket era.

 

[bottils]

"Haymarket" here refers to the location within London W. if I'm not mistaken. The company was known in it's earliest days as Loewe's of Haymarket.

The later, Civic era lower grades tried to capitalize on that and recycled the name, so to speak.

 

[Ahi Ka]

"Haymarket" here refers to the location within London W. if I'm not mistaken. The company was known in it's earliest days as Loewe's of Haymarket.

The later, Civic era lower grades tried to capitalize on that and recycled the name, so to speak.

All of the other Loewe that have passed through my hands have had the London W. COM. With the exception of advertising material or the shop address inside the cased pipes I have not seen the word Haymarket ever appear on the pipe itself - have you seen this?

I am just super curious as I too think it is a first from the 20s-30s, otherwise it would supposedly have a 2-digit model number as part of the ‘Haymarket’ seconds line (pre civic) or it would have a 3 (or more?) digit model number as part of the later civic series ‘Haymarket’.

 

[Ahi Ka]

Either way here’s the stummel and stem. Just need to get the rest of the gunk of the stinger and she’s good to go.

 

[Simplicity]

In this instance, Haymarket refers to the series. Birmingham, on the bottom of the shank, would refer to the location in England. The Pipedia article does mention a possible Haymarket series:

"Prior to 1955 Loewe had no series, stamping only the shape name on the underside of the shank. I have seen one Military marked with the series name Haymarket, which does not appear in any Loewe literature I've seen and could have preceded the introduction of series names for a brief period."

Additionally, I know that L&Co was stamped on the stem starting in the mid-fifties, at the start of the Late Haymarket period. I have a few of these pipes. I don't see that on this stem. Also, the presence of a stinger signifies an earlier period.

For the etching of dates, I think it would be odd for the same owner to use two different formats: day/month/year compared to month.day.year I think one person etched the first date and a subsequent owner seen that and etched in another date.

I am going to throw my hat in the time period of late 1940's - early 1950's.

 

[Ahi Ka]

I agree with all above except with Birmingham referring to a location. Birmingham is the shape/model name.

good spotting re the Haymarket series reference in the article. I had forgotten that.

I also like your idea of two owners etching the dates. Potentially both of their birth years?

Assuming the stem is original, I still think 30s as the decade of this pipe’s manufacture. Any earlier and the orific or slot bit would have been used, any later and I query the use of a stinger. Either way I’m content with the “middle Haymarket era” of 20s to mid 50s.

 

[Ahi Ka]

After cleaning the stummel I decided to look at the owner’s etchings a bit closer. I’ve done my best to take a pic close up that shows them.

it appears to only be one date with their initials underneath. The style of both lines of markings leads me to believe they are done by the same person. Unless the stem is replacement I am inclined to believe this is the owner’s DOB instead of the date of purchase of the pipe. However I’m gonna start looking for Loewe with stingers to compare.

I can’t tell if the initials are just W / H or if there is a middle letter too