Agreed! At church we were making cider not prastureized which means....thanksgiving and Christmas are going to be great! Got half a gallon and will be making hard cider. Iv made it twice before (yes I'm 18 not 21, parents are fine with it). I was smoking my Pete 80s rosslare with some Pete reserve 2012 and listening to Johnny jump up while drinking some homemade cider. It was wonderful. I'm a huge fan of Guinness extra stout