Dunhill Shell markings question

[fightintexasaggie]

I got hold of a Dunhill yesterday, and I'm a bit new to understanding all of their markings. The pipe is banded, so some of the nomenclature isn't visible, here's what is:
III Dunhill Shell Made in Eng[ cut off ]

Patent No. 417574/{cut off}
I take the patent numbers that it's likely a 417574/34 patent, and being a Shell the pipe should be somewhere in the 1950-1952 range, depending on the suffix that lay beneath the band.
Before the info if stamped a "III" - could this be the group number 3? I'm not sure if there lies another number beneath the band, though I would like to know.

 

[pruss]

So the rest of your nomenclature likely lives beneath that band, which is likely a repair band. Don't worry about it being a repair band, your pipe is beautiful, and if the repair was done correctly you'll have no impact on the smoking quality of your pipe.
The patent number on your pipe begins with 417574... which Pipephil tells us puts the date of the manufacturing sometime in the early 1940s: http://www.pipephil.eu/logos/en/dunhill/root-bru-guide.html?1940pat-60-1940z.jpg&32#1935
There are a couple problems with the condition of your pipe that will impact pricing, but have nothing to do with smokability.

1) The repair band, which we've already covered.

2) The pipe appears to have been over buffed. See how smooth the raised parts of the sandblast are, and how all that red is coming through? These are telltales that someone had a heavy hand with the buffing wheel.

3) It looks like, although this could be a picture quality issue, someone tried to touch up the nomenclature by re-etching the stamping. Take a look at the "Pat" of the patent, and the first numbers in the patent number.
Regardless of those aesthetic issues, your pipe is wonderful looking, and should smoke well. Congrats on your new burner, and enjoy it.
For more information on pipe nomenclature, take some time to explore pipephil. Here's another link to show Dunhill patent stamping: http://www.pipephil.eu/logos/en/dunhill/patent3.html#39
-- Pat

 

[jpmcwjr]

Nice looking smoker!
Would you mind sharing where/how acquired and ball park price?

 

[fightintexasaggie]

Would you mind sharing where/how acquired and ball park price?

Let's say I got lucky for my first Dunhill. Less than a hundred.
@Pruss

Thanks for the great reply. You helped a lot. I can see what you mean about double stamping and overbuffing. I think the reddish hue looks nice, I'll have to see how I like it when it arrives.
Can anyone link me to information about different repairs may relate to value of an antique pipe? Not planning on selling this one, merely curious.

 

[tobyducote]

Nice pipe...should smoke well

 

[jpmcwjr]

Can you say where/how you found it, purchased from whom?

 

[dmcmtk]

To answer one of your questions, the 111 is the shape number, shown here with a taper stem,
http://pipepages.com/dpsc3.htm

 

[dmcmtk]

And to narrow the dating, 1942-51,
http://pipedia.org/wiki/A_Dunhill_Pipe_Dating_Guide

 

[buroak]

fightintexasaggie, The pipe may be overbuffed, but the blast and finish may simply have been worn by years of handling. I have no links to offer, but a repair band and replacement stem will reduce the monetary value of the pipe by quite a lot.

 

[pruss]

fightintexasaggie, The pipe may be overbuffed, but the blast and finish may simply have been worn by years of handling.

This is true. The colour disparity between ridge and valley is what made me think of over-buffing. But handling could have similar results.
-- Pat

 

[fightintexasaggie]

@jpmcwjr - eBay score

@dmcmtk - thanks for the link!

@buroak - I figured as much, though for a personal pipe I'm not so worried. I'm not crazy about the band, but it's not a big deal. Can you tell me how to discern a replacement stem from an original? I assume you're saying this one carries a replacement. Thanks!

 

[pruss]

The easiest way to discern a replacement stem from original on a Dunhill is usually the presence, or not, of the white spot. No spot = replacement stem. Likewise, if the spot is off centre, too small or large, or wrong colour the stem is replacement.
Another way to check is to look up the shape of the pipe on the Dunhill shape chart. Is the stem the right shape/design? Dave's link above shows the 111 with a taper stem, not the saddle stem in your photos. Which might indicate that the stem is a replacement.
There are likely other ways to check, but these are the easiest. I don't know the 111 from Dunhill, and can't see the part of the stem which would show your white spot. So I can't definitively say whether it's a replacement of not.
I sold a 1977 Dunhill Root Briar with a replacement stem, with replacement white spot, which had been topped, for just over $100 at auction a few years ago. Aside from the stem and topping, condition of the estate pipe was 9/10.
Dunhill values ebb and flow and are determined as much by the folks bidding and the pictures as by the actual quality of the pipe on offer.
-- Pat
-- Pat

 

[fightintexasaggie]

Pat,
Again thank you for the info. The stem does have a white spot, but you have a good point about the shape chart. If the pipe is somewhere in the determined range, I wonder when Dunhill introduced their saddle stems. That could give me a clue!
One thing I do notice is the shape, or lack of shape in the button. It's barely there, nearly just a nub in the center. Is this characteristic of Dunhill saddle stems or possiy just worn/filed off at some point?
I'm very excited about this pipe. I'm planning on a thorough cleaning and breaking it in quickly... By smoking it slowly!