Do they or do they not make 'em like they used to?

[dryseason91]

Is there a general consensus that older pipes are just better? Is it a case of performance improving as briar ages further or higher standards of engineering 'back then'? (For example, I've seen it said often that the older Petersons are better constructed than you find nowadays.) Is there any truth to all this or is it mere nostalgia?

 

[spartan]

It's impossible to make em like they used to.
They don't make 70's boobs anymore either. Sorry to break the news to you.

 

[dryseason91]

My pipe is all I need to keep me warm at night, Spartan.

 

[spartan]

I would caution against using a single pipe to warm a household.
There's been tons of talk about this subject and I think the problem today is that the pipes may be hand finished but they are machine produced and are not receiving the attention they deserve because they're being pumped out so fast. You also get what you pay for nowadays as well. A nicer block of briar is going to cost you more.

 

[mso489]

That's a really interesting question, and impossible to prove. My oldest pipes provide the best smokes.

As the post says, the briar has had two or three decades to age beyond what it did at the pipe maker.

Older pipes have been kept and maintained because they are good smokers, whereas many of the less

good ones have been discarded. In the heyday of pipe smoking, in the 1940's, 50's, and 60's, there was

more profit in pipe manufacture, and more competition, hence a lot of pressure for quality. However, as

a debating point, I think a case could be made for pipes being made today being generally better. It's a

more limited consumer base, but more discerning. Just consider the brilliant and highly expert members

of Forums! Definitely individual makers veer from best quality from time to time. Though this rap has been

put on recent Petersons and some Lucianos, for example, my Petersons and Lucianos are all great smokers.

Out of about sixty pipes I've owned, I've unloaded only about twenty, only one for actual damage, a cracked

shank/bowl juncture, a pipe from the 1980s. I've unloaded the others for less good smoking characteristics,

and all of these were bought in the last five years.

 

[piperl12]

Thats a tough question because I don't think you can take emotion out of the equasion. I love my old pipes for all the reasons stated above, however I do believe my older pipes are dryer because they have had many more years to drive the moisture out of the wood. I think this makes my pipes more tolerable of wet smoking tobaccos. I also think like an old favorite sweater they just fit me. Someday the new pipes will feel like the old ones once they have earned their place. Kinda like my wife, after 20 years she just suites me better than the new models just don't tell her!

 

[pipestud]

I'm going to go down a different road here and it is only from my personal experience. Using American pipe makers as an example; there are a dozen of them I can think of who make pipes equally or better engineered than the old classics, equally well cured wood, and 8 times out of 10 better stem construction than most any of the old classics that we admire. And the art of sandblasting has grown by leaps and bounds.
Over the last 20 years in particular, the pipe makers have made many advancements in their making of quality smoking pipes. Equipment for machine made pipes is also more exacting that those of the 1950's and 60's that spit out hundreds of thousands of machine made pipes in assembly line fashion.
I do own some mighty fine smokers such as some pre-trans Barlings, old Sasieni Four Dots, etc, that smoke extremely well. Stem construction and the quality of the stems was not nearly as exacting as our truly gifted pipe makers of this day and age, however.
And choices! Back in the "Good Old Days," one's choice of brand, style, country of origin, etc, was extremely limited. Not so today. I think right now is the best time in history for a gentleman (and even not gentlemen like me), to enjoy pipes and pipe smoking.
Best,
Pipestud

 

[piperl12]

I was under the impression we were talking about factory pipes then and now. If we are talking Artisan pipes that changes things a little.

 

[numbersix]

FWIW (I am far from an expert), I would think today's makers are capable of making pipes equal to older pipes. I do think that older briar will generally smoke better, but I believe some makers (Dunhill, Savinelli, etc) have access to older stocks.

 

[bigbellypapy]

I think there are ways to improve on the way a pipe smokes but as far as older pipes go.They just don't put the time and effort in to the making of the pipe. No craftsmanship any more.wish I lived in the older days were things were made by hand with pride!

 

[cortezattic]

Nice discussion. G L Pease's article, This Old Pipe covers it in some detail.

 

[petes03]

I have pipes from the 60's through the present day, most of which are less than 5 years old. That being said, with some exceptions, my newer pipes smoke just as well as my older ones. My best smoking older pipes are my Ehrlichs and my Old Englands. My oldest pipe is my Charatan, and while it is a very good, quality built pipe, there's something about the way it smokes that I just don't enjoy as much as I do my others. I have a few pipes from the 90's that are excellent burners as well.

 

[sablebrush52]

Hi Dry,
Very interesting discussion! From my experience I don't think that one can make a blanket generalization. My oldest pipe is an 1896 Barling. My newest one was crafted for me a few months ago. Between those two I absolutely prefer the newer one. But also between those two are a lot of variations.

The Kaywoodies from the '30's were high grade pipes, crafted from 100 year old briar that was air seasoned for 5 years before being turned into pipes. The Kaywoodies from the '60's and '70's were "drugstore" pipes that were cheaply made from bad goods by a successor company. Today, Kaywoodies are a very fine make once again.

Every era has its fine quality and poor quality products. You've doubtless heard the term, shoddy. Its origin comes from a form of rag wool, wool made from woolen waste and old rags, and that term dates back to at least 1832. Shoddy became a common pejorative during the Civil War, used to describe poor quality goods that were being sold to the Union Army by profiteers. So not everything made years ago was good.

I agree with Pipestud that we are in a golden age of pipemaking. You can find wonderful quality today. I like Lee Von Erck's pipes as well as any Pre-Transition Barling that I own. And, Nording produces excellent pipes. So, for that matter, does Stanwell. And those are pretty big factory operations.

As for age being an absolute virtue in briar pipes, well, I think that that can be debated. Plenty of fine old pipes have been ruined by careless owners. Condition is more important than mere age.

Anyway, that's my three fingers of two cents plain.

 

[latbomber]

I remember seeing an article where the writer brought his collection of old Dunhills (1910's-1960's) to the Dunhill factory to interview one of the head staff there. After inspecting the pipes he said that several of them would have been rejected if they had been made today! I think alot of our thoughts toward old things is effected by "Stradivarious syndrome" The notion that something old (and expensive and rare) has to be better than the modern equivalent (even though repeated tests show that nobody can tell the difference)

 

[auslander]

I see this across the board with Spirits, Pipes, Clothing and almost everything else..the 'ah you should of been here yesterday, the swell was pumpin' attitude leads to a collective madness. There are so many affluent people in the world today that they will spend their money on any old crap just to have that 'thing'. Often the price of the old thing has next to nothing to do with quality. As I was searching pipes recently I thought to myself that this behaviour and attitude is especially prevalent in the pipe genre. With some pipes being ridiculously expensive for the single reason that it is perhaps a one off. Forget that the skill to make a pipe is not that high, ok it takes skill but we aren't talking rocket science here, we are talking a decent word working knowledge, some artistic if not somewhat limited flair and the ability to buy decent timber. That's why every second man and his dog is a pipe maker these days. I can't leave the house without tripping over ten of them.
That being said, I think that if something is mass produced there are going to be shortfalls in quality, if something is made on a small to limited scale then the likelihood of better materials and quality control are going to be higher.
If the market is so mad that it dictates exorbitant prices then it is ultimately unsustainable.
So my opinion would be Are older pipes better? maybe, dunno, not as a rule for sure.

 

[dryseason91]

Thanks for all the replies everyone. I suppose I would have assumed that pipe-smoking is less popular than it was, say, 50 years ago, and that therefore pipes are being produced on a smaller scale, which in turn would be conducive to greater standards of quality control.
@sablebrush52 - Interesting etymology of the word 'shoddy', I never knew that!

 

[northernneil]

I do not have much experience personally with old "estate" pipes, other than some old Parker's and Brigham's I inherited from my father. Nonetheless, I have talk with my tobacconist about this topic. His response to me was bring me in a Dunhill from the 20's and a Dunhill manufactured today. They both smoke great, but the new Dunhill looks better. The stems fit better. The blasts are better and the overall look is of higher quality. The key to me was that they both smoke great, the difference is in aesthetics.
As has been said above, I think it comes down to craftmanship and quality control. Artisan pipe makers will take more pride in there work, doesn't matter if they are from the 20's or today. Mass produced pipes will vary in quality, again, doesn't matter when they were produced.

 

[mso489]

To look at this a different way from my previous post, if I had to get rid of all the pipes I have more than

ten years old, I would still be a contented pipe smoker. I have thirty or more newer pipes that are well broken in and

fine smoking pipes. Also, I doubt that as many quality tobaccos and blends have ever been accessible to

so many pipe smokers before, with the internet and still a wide base of good retail shops. This may be

the golden age of pipe tobacco, and the pipes aren't far behind. Because of the internet, I surmise

(correct me if I'm wrong) that there have never been as many prolific pipe carvers at work.

 

[cigrmaster]

Pipestud said it very well. There are many artisans today who are making pipes much better than 50-60 years ago. The attention to detail in stem design and the engineering of the pipe makes for better smoking pipes. My oldest pipe is a Lane Era Charatan from the 60's and while it is a good pipe, the attention to detail does not compare to my artisan made pipes. The gap between the mortise and tenon is something you do not see in artisan made pipes of today. Their famous double comfort stem for my tastes cannot compare to a nice hand cut stem from a good artisan.
For my money I will take a 225.00 estate Rad Davis or Brian Ruthenberg or other artisan pipes over any older Dunhill or British made pipes.