A Tough Balancing Act

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rmbittner

Lifer
Dec 12, 2012
2,759
1,994
This has been on my heart today:
I have the highest admiration for Kevin, the moderators, Brian, and everyone who contributes in any way to keeping PipesMagazine.com a viable online source for all things pipe-related. It cannot be an easy job to maintain a commercial site whose foundation is a community of diverse individuals. (And I would argue that that's exactly the case here: without the community, there would be no advertisers or content; without the advertisers and content, the value to the community would be significantly lessened.)
Why mention this? I just noticed that a thread I contributed to this morning no longer exists. Not "closed"; gone. And then I got several personal messages from folks here who said they've noticed a recent, disconcerting shift in the administration's approach to managing the Forum.
I'm not second-guessing the behind-the-scenes forum-management decisions. I was president of an international organization that had to take drastic steps to keep our online forums as free as possible from personal attacks, heated arguments, and general negativity. It was painful for members to visit our site -- and equally painful to fix. But the result was an online community that was much more beneficial for all of our members.
So I can't imagine the work and discussions that occasionally need to happen among this site's administrators. I'm sure it isn't easy to send out reprimands or remove threads that may include some good points along with the objectionable material. But I don't think I'm speaking only for myself when I say that many people here are not just "forum participants" or fellow pipe smokers: They are real friends. And that can make these kinds of administrative steps seem harsh. It's easy to take them personally. And, based on some of the messages I've received, I think some here are feeling that, perhaps, the commercial concerns may be trumping the community that we've been allowed to develop here. It seems to me that both need to be respected and well-maintained if this site is to continue to flourish.
It is a tough balancing act. And I don't think I have any more of a point than that.
Respectfully submitted,
Bob

 

numbersix

Lifer
Jul 27, 2012
5,449
53
When stuff like that happens it can sometimes be difficult not to take it personally, but I would urge that it not be taken so.
I've been on several forums and I can attest that this type of "censorship" happens on all forums and all message boards as well as all comment sections. On some sites it can feel like an infringement on free speech - but I've come to realize that all of these places have to keep the peace with both its forum members and it's advertisers (and owners, editors, etc etc). This is not a public forum, it is a privately sponsored forum.
I may not always agree with the decisions made, but I also know that Kevin and the mods often have to act quickly. The mods aren't being paid and so should not have to spend a lot of their time worrying about whether or not a post should stay - when in doubt, strike it out is the smartest and quickest course of action.
I'd also like to say that I think this forum is actually very forgiving in most cases. Kevin has advertisers, some of whom take a beating on the forum. When that happens, Kevin runs the risk of losing business.
Consider that on most other sites you won't find any negative reviews on any product that site advertises. All in all, I can say that I am satisfied with the way things are run here.

 

woodsroad

Lifer
Oct 10, 2013
11,568
15,209
SE PA USA
Well said, Bob.
In the end, though, the balancing act is possibly a bit different: Maintain a forum that brings in a steady stream of eyeballs with a good demographic, keep it from self-destructing, and don't alienate advertisers. OK, it's slightly more complex than that, but at the end of the day, it all has to finish in positive territory or the lights go out.
I have no illusions of public service or altruism going on here. I'm on private property, and it is a privilege to stay, not a right.

 

latbomber

Part of the Furniture Now
May 10, 2013
570
4
The fact of the matter is that this is a completely free to join and open forum. The mods here are probably using a lot of their own time to work on it. No complaints here :D

 

dervis

Lifer
Jan 30, 2012
1,597
1
Hazel Green AL
Also worth mentioning THEY (being Kevin and mods) don’t own the rights to all Pipe Forums as a whole. Anything not liked about this one forum/website the person/persons can start their own. Make whatever rules and say whatever they want!
EDITED TO ANWSER QUESTION POSTED BELOW (good catch Woodsroad)

 

lordnoble

Lifer
Jul 13, 2010
2,677
14
While I can't comment on the aforementioned thread that disappeared since I'm not privy to the reason for its deletion, I can say that numbersix hit the nail on the head. Often we have to be quick on our fingers when we delete or close a thread. We try to PM the OP as to the reason, but sometimes (especially if we feel that the reason for the deletion/closure should be common sense or is one of our rules) we don't. The byproduct of this is the members who DID respond to the OP lose out as well. Believe me when I say that 99% of the time we don't want to close/delete a thread, but since Kevin relies on us to keep the forums running smoothly, we're bound by the rules that we all have agreed upon by joining and posting in this forum.
It's also possible that the OP requested that the thread be deleted. I just did that yesterday for a newer member who requested a thread he posted be taken down. In cases like this, I don't question, I just help out as best I can.
Thanks for understanding that our job ain't easy at times. We try to make this place the best we can because we believe the site (and the forums in particular) has real merit to the hobby. No, we aren't paid, but our payment is when threads like these or the ones espousing the virtues of the site are posted up. It makes us feel appreciated and that is truly a great feeling.
-Jason

 

warren

Lifer
Sep 13, 2013
11,699
16,205
Foothills of the Chugach Range, AK
We all need to remember that we are allowed to participate strictly on the sufferance of the owners of the site. We may be "members" but, we are subject to the rules and, sometimes, the whims of the overseers. I can live with that! I appreciate the effort and time that goes into moderating a site.
Further, should I become disenchanted with the site I can leave. There is absolutely no need to ever get into a pixxing match with moderators. None! Nada! Nil! Asking for a clarification is one thing, arguing is a no win situation.

 

taerin

Lifer
May 22, 2012
1,851
1
It's best to give your concerns about the way our forum is run in a pm to the people running it (Kevin). This is really his house and it is not up for public debate. With that aside, I love it and have no complaints, yes sometimes a thread disappears, which is annoying, but it's a side-effect of having a wonderful mod team enforcing a standard set of rules. Keep in mind that the reason threads disappear is because it is just the quickest way to get rid of them and it would be a huge hassle to pm every single person that posted in it about the thread's deletion and it would be silly to create a new thread outlining why an old thread was deleted.

 
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