Refreshing script on briar and stems?

[misterlowercase]

An aside, I do wish pipe makers felt obligated to stamp slightly more information. The city and year of manufacture would not be so much and would enhance the narrative that comes with a pipe.

I agree MSO,

a good point there.
Nomenclature plays a very large role with the unending appeal of Dunhill,

collectors love such stuff, myself included,

and I'd like to see more of that sort of thing.
As a collector, I really like the extra effort of a maker like Michael Lindner who came up with some wicked cool nomenclature,

the frogs, bats, and spiders etc...
http://www.pipephil.eu/logos/en/logo-l4.html

I once requested a special stamp after I learned that Ryan Alden used to use a Texas state shape and he put it on there for me...

I love such things!

:
Alberto Bonfiglioli also has a crazycool array of neat stamps!

::

 

[sablebrush52]

Interesting point of view which I hadn't thought of sablebrush52. My thoughts are that a fraud could only be such if 1) it was showing the pipe to be something it was not; 2) if the intention was to sell, trade or otherwise pass it onto someone, intentionally or otherwise (i.e. in death), as something it wasn't and 3) to imply to others, even if not for financial gain, something it wasn't and therefore elevating ones standing - entry into an exclusive club for instance. If any improvement or enhancement to the aesthetics of the stamping is declared at the time of the sale/trade/swap would this also count?
If the premium is on original condition, does then removing stem oxidation, tooth marks, bowl polishing and/or re-staining to improve the appearance of the pipe also count as fraudulent? What about stem repairs or replacement?
I fully appreciate the collectors market having a view on this as there could be large sums of money involved and thus any change may affect value. But to the pipe smoker (the emphasis here being on smoking rather than collecting) surely anything that enhances his or her enjoyment in the pipe can only be a good thing?
I have bought several high quality (if not necessarily high grade) pipes that have been restored in one way or another and never felt that there could be anything fraudulent in improving a pipe's appearance, so I'm very interested in your thoughts. Just for clarification, I am not a collector as such. My primary interest is in smoking the pipes I own. I do however, have a interest in pipes made by craftsmen and women, that are no longer in production: Barlings, Charatans, Loewes, Willmers etc.

Good questions! It's fraud when you don't reveal alterations at the time of sale. Collectors pay for original condition whether it's good, bad, or indifferent.
When a match was put to a pipe it's condition changed from unsmoked to smoked. Collectors pay a premium for an unsmoked pipe.they pay more for a pipe that appears to be in excellent original condition.
Cleaning the pipe or the stem isn't fraud, it's maintenance.
Collectors pay for clean nomenclature, but they want it to have survived in good condition as a testimony to the good care that the pipe received in its lifetime, not as a recreation.
But topping a pipe, resanding and reshaping it to remove "beauty marks" then restaining it and giving it a cheap stem and declaring that the pipe had somehow survived in such "lightly used" condition is fraud.

 

[blackbeard]

Dr. Grabow GRAND DUKE
That's how it would likely look if I tried to "improve" the stamping.

 

[okiescout]

"Dr. Grabow GRAND DUKE"
Tyler, does that look "original" to you? No, leave it alone.
Mrlowercase, that pipe of Mr. Lindner looks to be a honkin pipe! Beautiful, and yes, that spiders cool.

 

[bentbob]

Thanks Sablebrush52 for the info. I'm not a pipe collector as such so this is useful insight. The pipes I find, I buy for myself so again, I wasn't really thinking about re-sale value or what anyone else thought of them as I rarely sell pipes (although I have sold a couple recently).
I totally agree about trying to pass something off that it isn't, goes for everything really.
Having said that, I will still try to improve the look of the Charatan with the feint stamp although I don't know how yet. I did note that the text was much less visible after I had waxed it (Paragon Wax) so it might just be a case of letting the existing was wear off over time and using something else to bring a bit of shine to it.
Thanks again

 

[sablebrush52]

Having said that, I will still try to improve the look of the Charatan with the feint stamp although I don't know how yet. I did note that the text was much less visible after I had waxed it (Paragon Wax) so it might just be a case of letting the existing was wear off over time and using something else to bring a bit of shine to it.

Hi Bent
A couple of thoughts. Have you tested the stampings to see if there's an issue with wax build up? I bought a Barling quaint that looked like the carving had been pretty well buffed down. What I discovered was that the carving was buried in old wax, and when I removed that wax the carvings were pretty deep and well defined.
When using either Paragon or Halcyon wax products, I get the best result by spreading a tiny amount over the pipe with my fingertips, letting a little bit of the wax get onto the palms of my hands, then, after a minute or so to let it set up, rubbing the pipe in my hands, not a polishing cloth. I get a MUCH brighter shine than a cloth will offer.

 

[bentbob]

Hi Sablebrush52
I haven't worked out how to use the "quote" function yet - might even have to resort to reading the instructions.
"A couple of thoughts. Have you tested the stampings to see if there's an issue with wax build up? I bought a Barling quaint that looked like the carving had been pretty well buffed down. What I discovered was that the carving was buried in old wax, and when I removed that wax the carvings were pretty deep and well defined."
No I haven't. What would be the best way to go about this - is there a preferred method?
Thanks for the tip on waxing. I will give this a try next time I wax a pipe.

 

[brudnod]

Since Al has chimed in on this one, the analogy that Bob presents with motorcycles applies to old cars as well. Both Al and I own period MGBs which we take to shows and line up along with other old British cars. Great fun. Mine is a 1971 MGB-GT that looks nice enough but I have restored it with after market parts and old salvaged parts, some of which are from other year, other model MGs. If I were to try to sell the car as "original" I would be committing fraud; if someone comes by at a car gathering and asks me about the car, I am proud to say I picked it up for nearly nothing and have brought it back to glory. I would NEVER say that it was original.

And so your pipe may be modified in any way you wish. If you plan on selling it you would do so with full disclosure.

And, yes, trying to do script or block engraving with a Dremel is not likely to produce an appealing result...

 

[bentbob]

Hi Spencer, yes I completely agree.
Love the MGB GT's. Good driving position and all the controls fall to hand just right. I think all those that went out to the US had the black front bumper didn't they? I was a TR6 man myself. Sold my last one some years ago though.
As to engine, frame and chassis numbers, as mentioned by Northernneil again I completely agree. I once had a frame powder coated which filled in the numbers. The powder coating then had to be stripped back so that the numbers could be read as they are a legal requirement (I presume this is the case in the US too?) but more often than not, engine numbers etc get dirty and can be difficult to read, but this doesn't affect the appearance of the car or bike in general. I appreciate that the pipe maker's name, the model and grade of the pipe all affect value (and therefore some unscrupulous sorts might want to amend what is stamped), but they are an aesthetic part of the pipe too (as amply demonstrated by Misterlowercase's pics above). If I had restored a TR or MG, I would want nice decals and badges on it. I think I feel the same way about pipes. I want the pipe to be pleasing to me, I'm not to worried about it's financial value - whether it goes up or down due to any work carried out as this is not where my interest lies.
As it happens, I have seen pipes attacked with tools much more clumsy than Dremels!
During my apprenticeship, we had to be able to engrave copper, stone and aluminium by hand (for correcting errors during plate etching and engravings in general) to far greater tolerances than used in stamping pipes, this work usually being done under a 10X or 15X magnifying glass using a needlepoint picker (or scriber). Although I would be rusty and out of practice, I don't see why cleaning out stamping couldn't be achieved as it is simply as case of following what is already there, albeit wood has a much coarser cross grain than stone litho or soft metal. The tricky bit would be in making the right tool to do the job. Prior to metal type being used in letterpress printing, it was all wood letter.
Sorry to ramble on. Getting misty about the old days. It's all bloody digital now!

 

[ssjones]

That sounds pretty darn interesting bentbob, what was your business? From what you describe, you sound far better equipped to refresh nomenclature than most.

 

[brudnod]

Bob, even if you don't plan on selling the pipe you really should post pre- and post- restoration photos. Sounds like you might be able to pull it off!

PS - black bumpers for MG started in 1974 1/2...

 

[draco]

I want to say thank you for all the responses. I tend to agree that leaving the markings alone is the best practice besides a good cleaning. What is the preferred method of removing excess wax with minimal negative impact on our pipes?

 

[mawnansmiff]

An old thread perhaps but here's my tuppence worth. My other hobby is mineral collecting, particularly micro minerals. For best viewing of these minerals I use a low power (10x - 70x mag) Leica/Wild microscope. If you were to look at your stampings under the 'scope you would be surprised at how much wax & dirt collects in the stampings.
What I have done is (whilst under the 'scope) very carefully using a darning needle retrace the stampings with the point of the needle. You will be surprised as to how much muck comes out and your stampings are that much clearer.
This method works just as well on briar as it does vulcanite, the important thing to remember is to go slowly and steadily.
Another use for the microscope is in the cleaning out of the rings on a bulldog pipe though for this I will usually use a beechwood cocktail stick in place of the darning needle.
Other uses include looking down shanks and bowls to check for damage or stubborn tar deposits and inspecting the internal splay of the bit end of a stem. A great hiding place for pipecleaner fluff & tar.
Regards,
Jay.