Adam Smith, Penzance and a declaration

[tslex]

Adam Smith famously said "The price of a thing is what it will bring" -- or words to that effect.
So I haven't any meaningful cavil with anyone who wishes to sell, at mark-ups of several orders of magnitude for bags of Penzance or other Esoterica blends they happen to finagle, hoard, stockpile, couch, or otherwise snap up -- not because they care for the stuff, but because they plan to broker for and re-sale. I wish them every joy of it -- buyer and seller, both. No laws are broken. Up anchor, all debts paid, and no regrets.
But -- speaking strictly for myself, imploring no man to join me, impugning no man who thinks otherwise -- I'll be buggered into a cocked hat if I'll play that game from either side of the table.
When and if I stumble across another bag of Penzance someday from from a real seller, at the reasonable and widely set retail price, I might buy it. But, until then, I'll decline the dubious privilege of paying 4- and 5- and more-times the manufacturer's going rate to them as has. And when I buy, I'll buy the bag I plan to smoke and share. I'll forego the chance to buy the shelves clean gouging, er, satisfying the market (also known as my fellow pipe smokers). Sure I might make -- golly -- scores of dollars doing so. But then I'd have that taste in my mouth.
Adam Smith said "the price of a thing is what it will bring." True that. But some old Wall Street stalwart, his identity lost to us, known only to the ages, said another true thing:
"Bulls make money; bear make money; but hogs get slaughtered."
Here endeth the lesson.

 

[cobguy]

But -- speaking strictly for myself, imploring no man to join me, impugning no man who thinks otherwise -- I'll be buggered into a cocked hat if I'll play that game from either side of the table.

+1111 ... I especially hate to see this here on the forum. Gouging is for "Flea-bay"!
In fact, I've never paid for Penzance. The last batch I received was in a trade for Strang and I sent half of that away just yesterday as a surprise "freebie".

 

[peteguy]

DEFINITION of 'Scarcity Principle'
An economic principle in which a limited supply of a good, coupled with a high demand for that good, results in a mismatch between the desired supply and demand equilibrium. In pricing theory, the scarcity principle suggests that the price for a scarce good should rise until an equilibrium is reached between supply and demand. However, this would result in the restricted exclusion of the good only to those who can afford it. If the scarce resource happens to be grain, for example, individuals will not be able to attain their basic needs.
BREAKING DOWN 'Scarcity Principle'
When a product is scarce, consumers are faced with conducting their own cost-benefit analysis, since a product in high demand but low supply will likely be expensive. This means that the consumer should only take action and purchase the product if he or she sees a greater benefit from having the product than the cost associated with obtaining it.

 

[tslex]

OK, with Peteguy's post, HERE endeth the lesson.
(Ah, Intro to Marco Econ. Let's see that was 35 years ago. McMicken Hall. I mostly remember a lot of graphs with crossing diagonal lines.)
Of course that's all correct, except that it only speaks of the consumer's monetary CBA, it ignores two other factors:
1. The possibility that buyers who can well afford a good still choose not to buy it as some sort of Quixotic moral crusade, futile as that may be, and

2. the potential peril to the seller's immortal soul. . .
But then that's metaphysics or political science or theology -- in any case, another course altogether.

 

[deathmetal]

"Bulls make money; bear make money; but hogs get slaughtered."

And if you put enough hogs into a market, only slaughter remains.
This is why the Penzance I smoke was sold under its other name, Mixture 79.

 

[peteguy]

I am not saying it is right or wrong - that is way above my pay grade.

+1111 ... I especially hate to see this here on the forum. Gouging is for "Flea-bay"!

However, I do take notice of this type of thing. I don't recall signing anything that said cobguy or anyone else would have the responsibility on this forum to determine the line that if crossed deems you to be a gouger or unfit to post here, etc. Maybe it's Warren Buffet who is buying Esoterica Blends for $250 a bag - who are we to judge him or the seller? Mr Buffet has earned the right to spend his money.
Perhaps if nobody posts in a thread or buys the stuff at the asking price the seller will either quietly leave or drop the price?

 

[peteguy]

One thing I do know we can help monitor is posting more than one for sale thread a week. I believe that is clearly stated in the rules.

 

[tslex]

Of course, I do not speak of things so earthbound and practical as forum rules and posting practices. Those are worthy considerations, but I contentedly leave them for others. (Remember, we CALL it a forum, but really it's Kevin's living room -- he can do as he pleases -- and each of us can stay or go as we like. I have always been perfectly satisfied with how the proprietors here maintain their space.)
No. I'm on about things at much more elemental, existential and ethereal plane. Matters more lofty, one might say. What is right? What is wrong? What, even is good or evil? Just little matters like that. (But, of course, speaking strictly for myself.)

 

[fordm60]

Money and right or wrong is usually seperated, from what I have seen in life, because seems most people will do anything to get money. If you add right or wrong it makes people upset because of the reason in the previous sentence. I am no ones keeper, as long as they can look at themselves in the mirror guess they are OK.

 

[cobguy]

. I don't recall signing anything that said cobguy or anyone else would have the responsibility on this forum to determine the line that if crossed deems you to be a gouger or unfit to post here,

I merely stated that I didn't like seeing it here (personally) ... it doesn't fit with the usual camaraderie and generosity.
You don't have to be "designated with responsibility" to have an opinion on a forum, by the way. :wink:

 

[peteguy]

I understand everyone has an opinion and I always enjoy yours in threads such as these. When it is voiced in the sellers thread I think that crosses the line. I was not clear on this in my post and I am sorry if I didn't make that part clear. I was not trying to point the finger at you, or anyone else, in this thread.

 

[cobguy]

When it is voiced in the sellers thread I think that crosses the line.

I agree. It's the same with anything in the economy ... speak with your wallet.

I was not trying to point the finger at you, or anyone else, in this thread.

No offense taken whatsoever. You bring valid points to this discussion ... as usual!

 

[tslex]

When it is voiced in the sellers thread I think that crosses the line.

Peteguy, I really do agree with that. It's exactly why I started this thread as its own standalone discussion (one might say distraction? discursion? dissemble?) on the philosophical intersection of Adam Smith and Penzance.
Far be it from me to tortiously interfere in another man's business advantage.
Good order in discourse -- I'm all for it.

 

[cfreud]

Just speaking for myself, I don't buy tobacco or pipes for investment. I buy them to smoke them. I have smoked Penzance. I remember working at a B&M when Esoterica products were ample. I still have some Penzance jarred. I can't imagine paying whatever people are asking these days for an 8 oz. bag of the stuff. I don't get it. No judgement. I think about $120 or $150 and realize I could get a superb estate pipe or a ton of tobacco for that money. That's how I vote with my wallet.

 

[hiplainsdrifter]

What constitutes a "real seller"? Someone that gets it from Germain then triples or quadruples the price? Yeah, I can see how they are way better than someone that buys from a middleman then triples the price. :idea:

 

[peckinpahhombre]

What would forum life be without a daily penzance thread? Personally, I would be bored.

 

[didimauw]

We need more Damn Carter Hall threads!

 

[moriarty]

Of course it breaks no laws to buy more Penzance than you need, or to re-sell it at inflated prices to the people who were most keen to buy and smoke it in the first place. These things are simply a question of manners and consideration for others. You just have to decide for yourself how important manners are.

 

[bigpond]

I see your (loosely interpreted ) Smith and raise.

“The greater fool is actually an economic term. It’s a patsy. For the rest of us to profit, we need a greater fool— someone who will buy long and sell short. Most people spend their life trying not to be the greater fool; we toss him the hot potato, we dive for his seat when the music stops. The greater fool is someone with the perfect blend of self-delusion and ego to think that he can succeed where others have failed. This whole country was made by greater fools.”

― Aaron Sorkin

(Yes, that Sorkin...who'd a thunk?)

Achievement of your happiness is the only moral purpose of your life, and that happiness, not pain or mindless self-indulgence, is the proof of your moral integrity, since it is the proof and the result of your loyalty to the achievement of your values.

Ayn Rand

(Because I know a lot of you guys have closet altars to her)
PS My Eso overflow is still for sale!

 

[cynicismandsugar]

Someday, someone will start selling empty baggies, that once held Penzance, for $20. Maybe then I'll finally get a sniff at a price point that I can afford, and see what all the hype is about.