Yes, another Mason Jar question

danielplainview · Feb 18, 2015

I've asked this question a few times whenever I see the Mason jar storage topics pop up, but it gets overlooked in response to the OP question.
When storing in jars for the purpose of aging, Which way would see the most benefit?
1) Packed very tightly without airspace?
2) Packed loosely with a little airspace at the top?
I've never cellared tobacco for aging until joining the forum. (and other bad habits too. TAD/PAD. Thanks fellas)

I have several half pint jars I've managed to jam pack 1/4 pound into. After reading about the microbial transformation in long term storage I started wondering which way would reap the most benefit. Every in depth article I've read on cellaring covers every detail but this. Some might say its tobacco. Just smoke it already. But what's the point of keeping it stored for years without it reaching full potential. Has anyone else thought about this, or am I overcomplicating things?

desertpipe · Feb 18, 2015

I have been storing and aging in jars for a dozen years. Aros and Burleys get packed tight, while VA's and VaPers are packed looser with a small air gap under the lid. I have found that packing too tightly seems to slow down aging of the VA's in these blends. (Personal Opinion....worth about 2 cents)

pipestud · Feb 18, 2015

Dave, I have a lot of long-time tobacco collectors I work with and most believe that the tightness of the tin pack is less important than being sure to store the jars in cool, dry, dark places rather than out in the open. Sunlight can sap the flavor of the leaf through the jar - according to those collectors. I do have one collector, in particular, who has a different take. He likes to store his Mason Jars on the ledge of a window that faces the sun as it goes down during the summer months. He says after 2-3 months, the leaf darkens considerably and the taste of the tobacco is richer. Not sure any of this helps, but thought I'd pass it along for you to consider.

cosmicfolklore · Feb 18, 2015

I listen with perked ears to Pipestud, as he is more experienced in this. But, my thinking while I started my collection was based on what I had read by the tobacconist that have interest in this also. I packed mine rather loose with plenty of head room, because moisture and oxygen seemed to play a key role in aging. However, even if this is bunk, I still prefer to keep only about 2-3oz per jar, so that when I decide to break into a jar, I only disturb a small portion of my cellar, letting the rest continue working it's magic. Plus, about 2-3oz of a particular blend is all I want to smoke, before I start getting bored with it and looking to pop another jar.
So, whether air and water matter (But, I do notice darkening in my looser packed jars already), the best reason for packing loose and light is distribution. Unless you have a blend that you just know for certain you won't get tired of... you might consider packing light for the attention span of your own taste buds.

ericthered · Feb 18, 2015

As a pipe smoker with less than 3 years under my belt, I have no experience to speak from concerning cellaring over time. However, thinking about packing a jar of tobacco as tight as possible makes me wonder if, over time, due to the pressure, you would create almost a crumble cake scenario. The flavors might meld together more so than they would in a looser pack. If you have A LOT of tobacco to cellar, it would be interesting to pack one small jar loosely and one small jar as tight as you could and then see if there's a difference after whatever time interval you've set has passed.

vfefrenzy · Feb 18, 2015

I'm with the viking. The best way to find out is scientific testing. It may take a year or two to get a proper answer this way, but then you have the opportunity to do some scientific tasting. Also, if you need volunteers for some double-blind scientific tasting, I'd be willing to help you even if no one else here would ever volunteer. #VFL

delro · Feb 18, 2015

Doesn't matter how hard you pack or how loose time will still move forward and therefore age the tobacco. There will be air regardless.

desertpipe · Feb 18, 2015

Eric, it takes considerably more pressure to create a crumble cake then you can get by tightly packing a jar. I have a home made crumble cake press that exerts increasing pressure over several weeks. Easy to make, it produces a well melded cake.

billypm · Feb 18, 2015

If, as I understand it, aging takes place after the aerobic bacteria use up all the oxygen and die off and the anaerobic dudes show up to do their stuff, then it would follow that the less oxygen (air) in the jar the better. Not none, as a vacuum would provide, but only what happens to be in the jar after a nice full pack would do it.
As always, I have absolutely no evidence to support my view, and really very little idea what I'm talking about.

freakiefrog · Feb 18, 2015

The air space is what affects the humidity and moisture level in my experience. The more air you have the more moisture the tobacco will lose in order to achieve a RH balance. I've had big jars be perfect for the first 2/3's of the jar and then by the time I get around to the last 1/3rd it's getting pretty dried out. Because every time you open the jar the stable air is slightly replaced with outside air, thus causing the tobacco to have to lose moisture to achieve homozygous RH(relative humidity). I found a video Kevin did where he says that he keeps his in 4oz increments so that he's not opening a 1# jar to smoke out of. I do mine in 2oz jars for smoking and 4-8 oz jars for cellaring and I never open a cellared jar until the time. If I run out of the 2oz stuff I simply buy new and replace it..

cortezattic · Feb 18, 2015

With respect to aging for several years, the cost of bulk tobacco plus Mason jar(s) is pretty close to the cost of factory packed tins -- without any of the DIY hassles. I use Mason jars to keep a large number of blends in my rotation, but when aging is the objective, I'll go with sealed tins. As for how tightly to pack a jar, I think Cosmicfolklore, for all the reasons he has given, has it right at 2 - 3 ozs. in a small ½-pint jar.

igloo · Feb 18, 2015

I like the quart jars and pack them tight ,but it might just be me as I like to buy bulk and don't care for Mylar or plastic bags . For coin blends I pack loose just because I want them to stay coins . I also have about twenty jars of Swiss Delight a PS blend no longer available and it has retained it flavor so far . I don't know if loose or tight pack is best .What I do know is the blends need to be on the dry side and the jars cannot be cleaned enough . This lesson I learned the hard way .

buroak · Feb 18, 2015

Dave, like you I am pretty new to cellaring. I would pay more heed to the advice of more experienced folks. I will say, though, that I do not pack any tobacco I store in jars. I simply fill a bit, shake a bit to settle the leaf, and repeat until the jar is nearly full. The amount of space left at the top is dictated by the type of tobacco. I leave some space with Va blends, but fill all others almost all the way to the top. With non-Va blends I only leave space to ensure that tobacco does not get on the lip of the jar and compromise the seal with the lid.

escioe · Feb 18, 2015

I pack 2 oz into half pint jars. With flakes, there is all kinds of extra room. With some ribbons, I have to work a bit to get them in. The 2 oz serving size is more important to me than any minor differences in aging due to headspace.

wyfbane · Feb 18, 2015

I just jarred up 4lb or so yesterday in 4oz jars. I packed them pretty tight because they dang jars aren't as cheap as they could be.
I leave 3/8 - 1/2 in at the top for air, but like I said, they are packed pretty tight. I don't think this will mess up the tobacco, and I have plenty so this round will likely age 3+ years anyway.

smeigs · Feb 18, 2015

I pack mine pretty tight.. All the way to the top so there is not much room for air. I have had good luck this way the past couple years. Just store your tins in a cool, dark place and you should be good to go.

johnnyiii · Feb 18, 2015

I pack mine tight, but similar to cosmo I also pack some in a smaller working jar which is the one I open more often not disturbing my main stash. I however do not store to age but to keep fresh until I get to it.

danielplainview · Feb 18, 2015

Thanks for all the input everyone. I won't be disturbing the jars I already have sealed up, but the new additions will be packed a little more easily.
I'll jar up two batches of the same blend. One tight, one loose, and see if there's a difference in 5 years.
Stay tuned... :idea:

settersbrace · Feb 20, 2015

I've had jars stored as long as 10 years. Some full some not so much. The key as Pipestud said is to be sure the lids are tight and stored in a cool, dark environment. I use one of those cheapo styro coolers. It's the trapped air inside the jar that gets the magic going IMO. Just like so many tinned tobaccos taste better once the leaf gets some atmospheric exposure.

wyfbane · Feb 20, 2015

^ Nice. I have mine in my basement in a cupboard. I am unsure where it will go when I move this summer. I may have to bury it under the house in wooden crates. LoL

Yes, another Mason Jar question

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