Vulcanite premium $ over lucite stems

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Oct 7, 2016
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In browsing around the various pipe porn sites I am addicted to, something finally registered with me that I had not been paying attention to. Radice, as some of you might know, has long offered both Vulcanite and lucite stems. I was vaguely aware that the Vulcanite stems cost more.
However, what got my attention was that, judging from pricing on Al Pascias web site in US $ excluding VAT, the price of Vulcanite (they call it Ebonite) stems is about $40 more than Lucite. Now, I have read somewhere or other that right now Vulcanite rod stock is at a premium to Lucite rod stock, but that much? Is the US pricing difference similar?
Perhaps some of the pipe makers on this forum can weigh in. I have not bought a new Radice in many years, but the ones I have bought had well done hand cut mouthpieces. I have always been under the impression that it took just as much labor to hand cut a stem from one material as the other. For the record, I have had comfortable and uncomfortable mouthpieces made from both materials. But, depending on the price point you are looking at, $40 can be very significant-- a Sand Grain goes from a touch over $150 if memory serves to a tad under $200.
I would note that a higher % of the Al Pascia stock of Radices seem to be Ebonite as compared to the other Italian forum sponsor sites. Perhaps they are catering to a known existing preference of their customers?

 

didimauw

Moderator
Staff member
Jul 28, 2013
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Burlington WI
This is a very interesting topic. I have 4 pipes with vulcanite stems, and 4 with acrylic. I much prefer acrylic stems. Most people say they are harder (which I get, because it's more difficult to get teeth marks) but for me, they are much more comfortable. Almost as in, "softer".
Another point, my two most expensive pipes (that have vulcanite stems) were both about 40 to 50 usd more than my two favorite pipes with acrylic stems.

 

stvalentine

Part of the Furniture Now
Jan 13, 2015
808
13
Northern Germany
Although I find ebonite stems softer and easier to clench I hate their tendency to oxidize and the resulting work on them. Acrylic stems are easier to polish although you have to be very careful not to melt them in the process.

 

mso489

Lifer
Feb 21, 2013
41,210
60,455
In a really heavy pipe, the softer Vulcanite goes easier on teeth, but with light weight pipes, acrylic stays brighter and gets less tooth chatter. Some carvers seem to prefer Vucanite, like Johs, and I'm glad to go with that for his pipes.

 

Chasing Embers

Captain of the Black Frigate
Nov 12, 2014
43,413
109,219
Vulcanite is easier to work with and shape. Acrylic can discolor and bubble when sanding and shaping, and can be a major PITA.

 

ssjones

Moderator
Staff member
May 11, 2011
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Maryland
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That is an interesting observation. I don't buy that many new pipes, with stem material choices to have noticed a difference. I think randomly, I have heard vulcanite rod stock is more expensive. I also didn't know that Radice offered a choice. I wish Castello did that

 
Oct 7, 2016
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@chasing embers, you are saying at the pipe maker level, the labor difference is a material factor, or the material factor?
I suppose it is inevitable that this topic would cause a debate over the virtues of one versus the other. I am agnostic, but not at a 20% price differential at the sandblasted level, and a larger differential than that at the rusticated level.
Don't get me wrong,I own a couple of older Radice's with lucite stems and enjoy them. I saw a nice sandgrain the other day on Al Pascia, then clicked on it and saw the price was way more than I expected. I am not aware of any other maker that offers this choice. I certainly wouldn't mind trying one of their Vulcanite stems, but not at that price.

 

Chasing Embers

Captain of the Black Frigate
Nov 12, 2014
43,413
109,219
Labor, and material. Vulcanite can take more punishment in sanding and shaping. Friction and shaping create and need heat. You need a light touch when working with acrylic to prevent the formation of bubbles. Vulcanite, especially Cumberland rod stock, is slightly more expensive, but more of a joy to work with. At least for me. As I tend to lean towards pipes with vulcanite/ebonite/cumberland stems, never noticed a price difference.

 

Chasing Embers

Captain of the Black Frigate
Nov 12, 2014
43,413
109,219
Very welcome. Though I will agree with the masses that vulcanite upkeep is a big job, I will take it over acrylic any time I can.

 
Oct 7, 2016
2,451
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@chasing embers, count me among the masses, I guess, but I will repeat what I said in the opening post, I have had good and bad stems, as far as my comfort is concerned, made from both materials. One of the most comfortable bits I have ever had was on an Upshall that neverbend sold me as an estate pipe around 1995. When he was involved in Marble Arch, he had occasion, for reasons that I knew at the time but have forgotten, to send two long stemmed large lovats to Rich Lewis, who fitted both of them with lucite bits. I bought both. They were both comfortable, but one of them in particular was exceedingly so. So, based on that experience I have concluded in my own mind that the potential of what you can achieve with a lucite stem is higher than some might think.

 

georged

Lifer
Mar 7, 2013
5,535
14,206
Acrylic can discolor and bubble when sanding and shaping, and can be a major PITA.
You must be using some pretty unusual tools and/or techniques, then. I make equal numbers of each and don't have a "work with" preference. A few things have to be handled differently, but not many, and they are slight.
Some shapes allow no choice---vulcanite rod stock routinely comes in much larger diameters than acrylic---but that's about it.
As for which is the better material from a SMOKER'S perspective, I think acrylic---as long as it's the high quality cast stuff, not low quality and/or extruded---wins by a mile.
How vulcanite/ebonite came to be seen as the swankier choice is another story (and a long one), but isn't relevant to the thread in any event.
As for the $40 surcharge that some makers are asking for vulcanite, that's the first I've heard of it. I do very little Web surf-shopping, though. (My pipe racks have been full for years). Unless it is a direct pass-through of some dramatic price differential between materials, I'm calling BS on any claim that's labor related before even hearing what it is. :lol:

 

Chasing Embers

Captain of the Black Frigate
Nov 12, 2014
43,413
109,219
No unusual materials, rod stock purchased from Pipe Maker's Emporium.
Vulcanite

img_20130630_160852-600x450.jpg

Acrylic

img_20130806_144014-600x450.jpg

On a belt sander, get a stronger more acrid smell with acrylic and burning rubber with vulcanite. If I leave the acrylic touching the sander for too long, bubbles form under the surface.

 

georged

Lifer
Mar 7, 2013
5,535
14,206
On a belt sander, get a stronger more acrid smell with acrylic and burning rubber with vulcanite. If I leave the acrylic touching the sander for too long, bubbles form under the surface.
It's one or more of these things:
-- badly worn belt or belt grit too high (smooth)
-- belt speed too high
-- too much pressure when shaping

 
Oct 7, 2016
2,451
5,195
I checked Pipe Smokers Emporium and also Vermont Freehand The cost of German Ebonite and Cumberland rods seems to be a good bit higher than acrylic, but that is to my untrained eye.

 

zack24

Lifer
May 11, 2013
1,726
2
The price of ebonite vs acrylic rod stock is pretty irrelevant in the scheme of things. A lot of the European makers are using automated equipment on the acrylic. For the price to be $40 higher in ebonite, that would indicate to me a handcut stem- it's the difference in process, not the difference in cost of rod stock...I haven't noticed any extra time required for either material on handcut stems....

 

mso489

Lifer
Feb 21, 2013
41,210
60,455
All Vulcanite oxidizes to some degree, but most new pipes don't show that much oxidation on a Vulcanite stem for years. However, when you get into some of the older Vulcanite, even if it's been maintained and not stored in sunlight, it can oxidize in a single smoke after an energetic polishing. At that point, I'm ready for a good replacement acrylic stem. I had one that oxidized to a gray-white gritty surface in a hour after one smoke after a good polish. The briar was easily worth the replacement.

 
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