Virtual Tobacconists?

hfearly · Feb 20, 2013

Some of you might have seen the Dunhill comparison chart I posted some days ago.
The whole thing got me thinking... what if an online retailer would be able to become your "Virtual Tobacconist". You know, you tell him what kinds of blends you have liked in the past, and what kinds of tobaccos you appreciate in the blend that you are looking for to try next, and he will give you a list of recommendations, and you can just click and order right away.
Mmmh... maybe I'll build a prototype of such a system on the weekend. I've already mined close to a million tobacco reviews from the internets (currently I have them all in a personal iPhone app which will compute me a star rating for each tobacco - has been tremendously helpful at my local B&M stores over the past couple of months, see screenshots below).

In any case, would you guys use something like that to "discover" new tobacco blends to try? Would that even be interesting? Say maybe something like a simple question answer game that goes like:
Site: What kind of Tobacco are you looking for?

You: A Virginia/Perique blend

Site: What other tobaccos did you like so far?

You: Mhhh, lets see ... Escudo, Deluxe Navy Rolls, Reiner Long Golden Flake

Site: Based on what you told me, I think you might enjoy these: 4th Generation 1931, Rattray's Hal'O Wynd, SG's St. James Flake.
With the current information, I think I could easily link tobaccos through a network graph, which in turn will instantly tell me "people who liked blend X also liked blends Y and Z in the same category" ... Mmmh, if that's not going to be a TAD enabler then I don't know. Dangerous for my wallet ...
In any case, I guess my questions would be this: what would you like to see / what would you consider most helpful about something like a Virtual Tobacconist who has in-depth knowledge of more than 5,000 tobacco blends? I've got all the raw data and I want to do something useful with it.

quincy · Feb 21, 2013

Dude! What is that program called that you screenshot? Is it available to other people?

joshwolftree · Feb 21, 2013

that would be interesting, though maybe as an app perhaps with an online server that can integrate both members (X,Y,Z) enjoyed tobaccos (A,B,C) similarity graphing and a user updated, blend (A) is rated as similar too blend (B) in the following categories
(#) users rate at (#) stars

Body

flavor

room note

whatever other categories
user could pull up two blends

and rate their similarity with we'll say the standard 4 star system

or look up those ratings submitted by other users
for instance

GLP odyssey+frog morton
flavor rated at 3 stars by 15 out of 25 users (or whatever rating has the highest percentage of users)
I'd use it, plus as I explore further tobaccos I can fell like I'm helping others explore without the lengthy review writing(for those days when I'm being lazy)

just pop in and go oh well it taste like... and the room note is similar too...but it feel much lighter

hfearly · Feb 21, 2013

Dude! What is that program called that you screenshot? Is it available to other people?

I called it "Tobacco Reviews 2 Go (TR2GO)", however, I have not submitted it to the iOS appstore, so far it's my only little 'pet' program. I'd just give you a copy, but as I understand, the iPhone appstore is quite restrictive in that manner. I think I can give a limited amount of people an application as a beta tester by recording their unique device ID and sending them a signed provisioning profile in return ... it's pretty complicated.

user could pull up two blends

and rate their similarity with we'll say the standard 4 star system

or look up those ratings submitted by other users
for instance

GLP odyssey+frog morton
flavor rated at 3 stars by 15 out of 25 users (or whatever rating has the highest percentage of users)

I don't think there even is a need for that. a lot of the reviews contain references to other blends ("quite similar to MM965 but with less Latakia") ... and I also know for a lot of folks which blends they like and dislike, so I can compute kind of 'majority' profiles already. I'm testing something right now to see if it will bubble up the "blends I like".

hfearly · Feb 21, 2013

Ha! It worked! I asked it for the most popular Va/Per blends based on my liking of Reiner LGF, Escudo and Marlin Flake. This was the answer (ordered by popularity).
Format is Brand | Blend Name | Ingredients | Average Star Rating | Popularity | Tobacco Strength
Damn it! Now I have to Order Haddo's Delight and Captain Bob in my next TAD ... :-(

pstlpkr · Feb 21, 2013

Believe me you won't be disappointed with :worship: G.L. Pease Haddo's Delight
: puffy

:

wnghanglow · Feb 21, 2013

I know your not close to completion by have you looked into what it would take to get into the apple store? I like your effort and there's no way I wouldn't pay you for it!

quincy · Feb 21, 2013

Yeah I'm with the guy above. I'd she'll out for a decent pipe program

bogglor · Feb 21, 2013

Hey hfearly -- I had contact with the writer of the Pipe Tool app (check for my thread on internet pipe tobacco cellars it a couple of weeks ago) and he informed me (via e-mail) that the TR people are shall we say, less than cooperative when it comes to use of their data. Just wanted to give you a heads up going forward should you decide to submit to go through Apple's absurd process.
In other news, your app looks pretty cool. Now you just need to add a cellaring feature and we're getting somewhere!

rmbittner · Feb 21, 2013

I had contact with the writer of the Pipe Tool app (check for my thread on internet pipe tobacco cellars it a couple of weeks ago) and he informed me (via e-mail) that the TR people are shall we say, less than cooperative when it comes to use of their data.

This *may* be based on old information. TR.com is now owned by the folks who own Pipes & Tobaccos magazine. I would be shocked if they didn't want to allow the use of their data since it would lead to tobacco interest (which would help their publication) and tobacco sales (which would please their advertisers). If they require a fee, then just pass that along to the App users.
If I saw this in the App Store, I'd definitely try it. But time would have to tell whether I'd keep it around or not. It would be important to me that it be available for both iPad and iPhone -- and not in a version that requires the user to 2x to get a full-screen image on the iPad. (Also, I can't help being turned off by the misspelling of "tobaccos" in your initial screen shot. I know that's just for your use, but I would hope that kind of error wouldn't appear in an "official" app.)
I will say that I've tried Pipe Tool and thought it was very poorly done. After keeping it around for months in expectation of an update, I deleted it when it became clear that no updates would be coming. There's definitely room for an app that would do the job better.
Just so you know where I'm coming from: I've owned an iPad since 2010 and an iPhone since 2011. We're currently a 2-iPad family (both Ipad 2s: one 64GB, one 32GB), and we have over 350 apps. Between my wife and I, we probably use our iOS devices for a combined total of seven hours a day during the week, more on the weekends.

fitzy · Feb 21, 2013

I'd love to have that app.

hfearly · Feb 21, 2013

I had contact with the writer of the Pipe Tool app (check for my thread on internet pipe tobacco cellars it a couple of weeks ago) and he informed me (via e-mail) that the TR people are shall we say, less than cooperative when it comes to use of their data.

This *may* be based on old information. TR.com is now owned by the folks who own Pipes & Tobaccos magazine. I would be shocked if they didn't want to allow the use of their data since it would lead to tobacco interest (which would help their publication) and tobacco sales (which would please their advertisers). If they require a fee, then just pass that along to the App users.

The pipe tool app tries to be a solution to managing your cellar. Which I personally won't attempt for a number of reasons (too many different use cases and requirements, and alternative solutions like a simple spreadsheet on dropbox are a lot simpler/useful).
What this app does for me (surprise, I wrote it for myself!), is give me instant access to a myriad of ratings for the tobacco from across the internet in the blink of an eye. I've had so many times my tobacconist come over and tell me about those "awesome new tins he got in yesterday" which I had never heard of. Open app, type 4-5 letters, click and I know exactly how "awesome" the tin really is on a scale of 1 to 5.
No, what I really want to do is use advanced data mining methods to unlock the full potential of this dataset for tobacco discovery and recommendation. And let's face it, most interfaces of today's available tobacco and review websites are horribly ugly, non-functional and outdated.
By the way, I calculated Facebook-Style likes and dislikes over the database, and it's pretty amazing which blends people unanimously like. A sneak peak below

. I can only image how useful such a list would be if I were to cellar large amounts of tobacco with the idea of investment *cough Harris, cough* :nana:

bogglor · Feb 21, 2013

I will say that I've tried Pipe Tool and thought it was very poorly done. After keeping it around for months in expectation of an update, I deleted it when it became clear that no updates would be coming. There's definitely room for an app that would do the job better.

The reason for this is because his old terms of use was with the previous owner of TR. The new owners (the magazine) have told the creator of Pipe Tool that they have no interest in helping him update his application with new data and that his terms of use do not allow him to scrub the site (in the way that hfearly's app is).

wnghanglow · Feb 21, 2013

According to your research my favorite tobacco is everyone's favorite tobacco! *talking of course of number one on the list, Larry's Blend*

phred · Feb 21, 2013

I don't currently know enough about tobacco to provide any useful interface suggestions, but I would certainly be interested in purchasing a retail copy if/when it became available, as it's pretty much exactly the sort of thing I'm looking for with regard to "I liked X, Y, and Z, but not AA - what else is out there that I might like?" kinds of questions. Especially since I still can't seem to log on to the forums from any of my mobile devices (I think my password may be the issue, but I haven't got around to changing it to test my hypothesis yet) - it would be great to have on a trip to a B&M.

dragonslayer · Feb 22, 2013

Gleaning information off the web is probably not the best way to establish a solid database. If you look at one site that probably is giving you the most information Tobaccoreviews.com. The information is skewed by people who give anything they like 4 stars and represent only the few % of tobacco people, and who post only the brands they like.
Querying databases is tricky, they are inherently wrong most of the time, which by your programming skills I’m sure you know. Creating a better way to populate the DB with more information and fields to query over an app/website would really give it a more accurate output.
You could probably get a better query off the inventory sales at P&C for the last 5 years.
Programmer from ‘76

Craig

hfearly · Feb 22, 2013

Dragonslayer: you are right. the actual "X star" rating is completely bogus, as skewed. I'm now using an alternative measure where I translate reviews into "I like it" and "I don't like it" style recommendations for or against a tobacco. I've since packed some knowledge into a test program, which can recommend tobaccos to me, based on what most others have liked in the past who also liked blend X (pretty much what Amazon does with their people who bought X also bought Y).
Example:
$ RecommendToMe.exe "Aged Burley Flake"
Looking for recommendations based on Solani - 656: Aged Burley Flake
21 recommendations for Peter Stokkebye Escudo Navy Deluxe. This blend is recommended by 88% other pipe smokers.

20 recommendations for Solani 660: Silver Flake. This blend is recommended by 94% other pipe smokers.

18 recommendations for Samuel Gawith Full Virginia Flake. This blend is recommended by 88% other pipe smokers.

17 recommendations for McClelland Personal Reserve: Blackwoods Flake. This blend is recommended by 90% other pipe smokers.

17 recommendations for Dunhill My Mixture 965. This blend is recommended by 76% other pipe smokers.

16 recommendations for Peterson Irish Flake. This blend is recommended by 85% other pipe smokers.

16 recommendations for Rattray Old Gowrie. This blend is recommended by 89% other pipe smokers.

14 recommendations for Dunhill Nightcap. This blend is recommended by 85% other pipe smokers.

14 recommendations for Esoterica Tobacciana Stonehaven. This blend is recommended by 93% other pipe smokers.

13 recommendations for Reiner Long Golden Flake. This blend is recommended by 91% other pipe smokers.

13 recommendations for Dunhill Early Morning Pipe. This blend is recommended by 76% other pipe smokers.

13 recommendations for Orlik Tobacco Company A/S Golden Sliced (Red). This blend is recommended by 83% other pipe smokers.

13 recommendations for Esoterica Tobacciana Penzance. This blend is recommended by 87% other pipe smokers.

12 recommendations for Cornell & Diehl Simply Elegant Series: Opening Night. This blend is recommended by 89% other pipe smokers.

12 recommendations for Samuel Gawith Best Brown Flake. This blend is recommended by 88% other pipe smokers.

11 recommendations for Mac Baren HH Mature Virginia. This blend is recommended by 88% other pipe smokers.

11 recommendations for Cornell & Diehl Simply Elegant Series: Sunday Picnic. This blend is recommended by 88% other pipe smokers.

10 recommendations for Dunhill London Mixture. This blend is recommended by 82% other pipe smokers.

10 recommendations for Rattray Hal O' the Wynd. This blend is recommended by 89% other pipe smokers.

9 recommendations for Rattray Marlin Flake. This blend is recommended by 83% other pipe smokers.

9 recommendations for McClelland Personal Reserve: St. James Woods. This blend is recommended by 79% other pipe smokers.

9 recommendations for G. L. Pease New World Collection: JackKnife Plug. This blend is recommended by 92% other pipe smokers.

9 recommendations for Dunhill Royal Yacht. This blend is recommended by 63% other pipe smokers.

9 recommendations for pipesandcigars.com Anniversary Kake. This blend is recommended by 86% other pipe smokers.

9 recommendations for John Middleton, Inc Carter Hall. This blend is recommended by 74% other pipe smokers.

8 recommendations for Cornell & Diehl Briar Fox. This blend is recommended by 76% other pipe smokers.

8 recommendations for Mac Baren HH Vintage Syrian. This blend is recommended by 80% other pipe smokers.

8 recommendations for Samuel Gawith St. James Flake. This blend is recommended by 89% other pipe smokers.

8 recommendations for Peterson Peterson's Perfect Plug. This blend is recommended by 78% other pipe smokers.

8 recommendations for G. L. Pease Old London Series: Chelsea Morning. This blend is recommended by 86% other pipe smokers.

8 recommendations for Wessex Brigade Campaign Dark Flake. This blend is recommended by 96% other pipe smokers.

8 recommendations for G. L. Pease Original Mixtures: Haddo's Delight. This blend is recommended by 74% other pipe smokers.

7 recommendations for Samuel Gawith 1792 Flake. This blend is recommended by 69% other pipe smokers.

7 recommendations for William P. Solomon Presbyterian Mixture. This blend is recommended by 76% other pipe smokers.

7 recommendations for Rattray Red Rapparee. This blend is recommended by 89% other pipe smokers.

7 recommendations for G. L. Pease Heirloom Collection: Westminster. This blend is recommended by 86% other pipe smokers.

7 recommendations for Sobranie of London Original Mixture. This blend is recommended by 91% other pipe smokers.

7 recommendations for McClelland Grand Orientals: Classic Samsun. This blend is recommended by 96% other pipe smokers.

7 recommendations for Prince Albert Prince Albert. This blend is recommended by 69% other pipe smokers.

7 recommendations for McClelland Frog Morton. This blend is recommended by 80% other pipe smokers.

7 recommendations for G. L. Pease Original Mixtures: Samarra. This blend is recommended by 84% other pipe smokers.
So I'd probably go and try some Silver Flake, Blackwoods Flake, Reiner LGF and Jackknife Plug because they are also highly recommended by people across the board. I've been playing around for an hour or so and this thing is the most dangerous TAD enabler I've come across... :evil:

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