The Gwaith and Hoggarth Lakeland Mystery

andrew · May 4, 2014

I keep reading these reviews on G&H blends being a soapy mess, even if they're supposed to be unscented. I have to say I just got an order of Brown flake unscented, and I can't detect even the slightest bit of lakeland flavour, all I can taste is top notch Va with some high quality burly resulting in a beautiful nutty finish. Same with Bob's Chocolate flake, all I can taste is the equivelent to smoking a brownie. It's like if God made an aromatic, it would be Bob's Chocolate flake.
It makes me wonder

a) Are people getting the wrong flakes when they order unscented, as there's brown flake aromatic, scented, and unscented?

b) Do some companies store all of these G&H blends together and the lakeland scent transfers over?
I've heard of the idea that the machinery they use may do this, so

c) Does it depend on where in the production stage at G&H depend of what degree of lakeland transfers over? IE near the beginning of a batch of an unscented flake do the leftover flavors transfer but then towards the end the other flakes are free of this?

or

d) are some people just putting up bullsh*t reviews to give G&H a bad name? (read tobbacoreviews.com)
I feel like G&H has gotten a bad rap from quality control over this, but after taking the plunge into G&H flakes I'm finding them to be some of the best Va's I've smoked. So I'm in the camp of no, the flavors don't transfer over into the unscented flakes and G&H is one of the best Va blending houses in the world.
The G&H flakes I have received from 4noggins have been completely free of lakeland essence.

latbomber · May 4, 2014

My guess is b,c, and d. SG blends have the same complaint from time to time. Seeing as how both blenders use very old machinery and hand blend everything, it isnt surprising that flavours transfer a bit.

novicemaker · May 4, 2014

well having cleaned a few different kinds of factories id say you are pretty close to the answer with residue transfer. Seeing as these items are sealed then shipped from the processor i wouldn't think there would be much of essence on the tins themselves to transfer anything, but the machines can never be truly 100% clean of oils and chemicals so some transfer very well could happen.

lostandfound · May 4, 2014

I've been smoking some Best Brown Unscented recently, and I can definitely taste the "floral essence".
My girlfriend and I were leaving our local bread store when a couple of older ladies walked in. As they passed by us, I caught a whiff of G&H's Best Brown Unscented.
So, I don't know if SP.com messed up my order, or what... but yeah... it's definitely there for me.

sallow · May 4, 2014

Essence or no essence, Bob's Chocolate is a fantastic blend. I have never tried their unscented blends - never needed to. It would be like eating shrimp without the remoulade.

mrenglish · May 4, 2014

It's there. I can taste it on my Bright CR and Louisiana Flake. Its very light but noticeable. In my opinion, its simply because they run all of the tobacco through the same machines during manufacturing.

captainsousie · May 4, 2014

I bet a lot of the taste is the power of suggestion. When somebody is doing a coffee or beer tasting they will give you notes. Then, when you tell them what notes you are getting, they will happily agree that they 'taste' them even if it is opposite of their earlier notes. I am the first to admit my tastes are not all that great but I get no Lakeland taste from Squadron Leader even though many will swear to how soapy it is.

andrew · May 4, 2014

See Best Brown #2 is supposed to be lightly intentionally scented with the lakeland flavor, which I could taste in the background, so when I went to order a pound of BB#2 it was out of stock so reading through the reviews of Brown flake unscented I was under the impression it would have some of the carry over scent and be similar to BB#2, but there's absolutely no lakeland flavor to the unscented. I realize that yes the lakeland is intentional in alot of their offerings as they are a lakeland producer, but I cannot taste any carryover in the unscented flake. I do have some dark flake unscented and Lousiana flake coming so I'll have to see if there is any carryover on these. If there isn't it leads me to believe 4noggins must be doing something right with their storage of these flakes.

docwatson · May 4, 2014

andrew says:

G&H is one of the best Va blending houses in the world.

It certainly is, hands down. :clap:

dochudson · May 4, 2014

I think a lot of the folks bad mouthing G&H swearing every blend taste like soap may be a subset of the folks who always swear about construction problems with Peterson pipes.. and when they are pushed admit they read it on the internet so it must be true but never owned or handles a Peterson or G&H tobacco.

rcstan · May 4, 2014

Indeed, #2 does have some floweriness. But nothing like Ennerdale. Sometimes the flavors do cross.over.but not in any significant manner. Sniffing at jars can be deceiving too. BF Unscented has this latent rose water thing going on, but the actual taste is nothing like it; whilst a quality tobacco, I find it to taste more akin to a quality European cigarette from long ago than what some here call "soapy". But then again, if I wanted to smoke a dried up tobacco leaf, I'd just do that, rather than look for a blend that tastes like it......

bryanf · May 5, 2014

I have never smoked a GH blend I didn't like. No other flake burns as evenly as theirs, and the moisture level is always perfect. Ennerdale and Dark Flake are favorites of mine, as well as their black and brown twists, which I've started to smoke more often.

cortezattic · May 5, 2014

Ditto Michael (mrenglish)

It's there. I can taste it on my Bright CR and Louisiana Flake. Its very light but noticeable. In my opinion, its simply because they run all of the tobacco through the same machines during manufacturing.

...not that it's a bad thing, the way the floral tastes peek through in my sample of those two blends, and it isn't a case of bad-mouthing G&H. There are plenty of G&H blends I like -- including my tainted samples of Bright CR & Louisiana Flake. While I'm not a fan of the Lakeland scented stuff, a little hint of it here and there, now and then, is a definite plus. May they never change.

cosmicfolklore · May 5, 2014

The first few ounces I smoked of SG's Dark Flake Unscented in bulk form, I loved. But, then when I reordered it along with some Kendal Flake and Scented Dark Flake to give the lakelands a try, my Unscented Dark Flakes had absorbed some of that lakeland-ness, I think.

For me, I just didn't like the lakeland taste as it reminded me too much of my grandmother's bathroom. I am still not 100% certain that I was just not tasting the slight hint of lakeland in my first ounces of unscented (because I wasn't sure what lakeland was), or if ordering it along with the true lakelands transferred the aromas to the unscented.
I will say that I am apprehensive about trying any more of the SG or G&H blends. Even the slightest of scent of lakelands really sets off my gag reflex. I know, I know, I'm such a ninny.
However, I'm glad there are guys out there that like it. It's such a historical blend that I'd hate to see either of these companies stop production.

voorhees · May 5, 2014

I smoked some Chocolate Flake over the weekend and since I had tossed the tin when I jarred it, after firing up a bowl looked up the blend online to remind myself of its mixture.

I noticed "Lakelands" mentioned, so I paid close attention to the flavors I was getting. I did get a florally aroma, but did not enjoy the bowl until about half way through once the flavors settled in.

Overall, I will be smoking it again to further my experience.

bphilli75 · May 5, 2014

I had a one ounce bulk bag of Ennerdale Flake I had to move completely out of my large tobacco drawer. The smell from it overpowered everything else, even seeming to permeate some of my other bulk bags. With due respect to those who enjoy it, that stuff just isn't for me.

pitchfork · May 5, 2014

I'm certain that BB#2 has some combination of Lakeland flavors in it -- either from the machinery or intentionally added to the leaf. I've always loved it, but when I first started smoking it I didn't taste the Lakeland stuff at all. Now I recognize those aromas right away in BB#2. To be sure, they're subtle, but there's no question of their presence. I've gotten this from multiple batches, so it's not just a contamination issue from other tobaccos nearby. I would say the same thing about Brown Flake U/S -- the Lakeland flavors are there, but not overwhelmingly so.
As for Louisiana Perique Flake, that stuff is definitely cased or topped with some Lakeland juice. I like Lakelands of all kinds and I like Vapers, but the combination just didn't work for me.

clickklick · May 5, 2014

I don't believe brown flake unscented or Bobs Chocolate Flake are considered to have the "Lakeland" scent. Try Ennerdale or Broken Scotch Cake and you may find the floral soap some people refer to.

peter70 · May 5, 2014

As much as I like the taste of the Gawith products, SG and G&H, I would wish for a better consistency. Sometimes the cut is way different in one tin, from very thin to thick slices, sometimes the flavor is stronger or weaker, or completely different. The wetness does not add to my enjoyment, too. And once I got a tin of FVF and there was definitely a Latakia flake in it, so they messed with the tin lids. I find many other good flakes around, which have none of these problems, so I have more or less stopped smoking tobaccos from the Gawiths.

mrenglish · May 5, 2014

I have smoked many, many pounds of their blends over the years and with the exception of St. James Flake, prefer G&H over SG. More often than not, the unscented blends have a slight scent in my experience. I personally like it and am just speaking from my own experience so please do not construe my earlier post as a bash against G&H.

The Gwaith and Hoggarth Lakeland Mystery

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