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Perique in HotW and Old Gowrie? Not according to the blender

(29 posts)
  1. judcole

    Jud

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    Today I popped a nice new tin of Rattray's Hal o' th' Wynd.Included was a nice little booklet describing each of the Rattray blends, in English and German. With all the claims lately, based on website descriptions, that HotW and Old Gowrie were Va/Pers (much to the surprise of long time fans of these fine blends,who thought they were Virginias), I read the descriptions.
    Although Perique is mention as being an ingredient in both Marlin Flake and Dark Fragrant, it is not mentioned for either OG or HotW.
    OG is "Virginia tobacco pressed as a broken flake following the old traditions of Charles Rattray. A spicy, yet noble tobacco with cool characteristics and subdued sweetness. The tobacco gets its harmonious flavour from several weeks of maturing."
    HotW is described thus: "A full-bodied Virginia tobacco with a slight sweetness and extremely pleasant smoking characteristics. The name comes from that of the armourer in The Fair Maid of Perth - a man who had a most unusual share of strength."
    I'm sure they would have mentioned Perique if it was there. And,yes,I know what the website says.

    Thought in the early morning, solace in time of woes,
    Peace in the hush of the twilight, balm ere my eyelids close
    Rudyard Kipling
    Posted 4 years ago #
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    clarkj734

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    Having smoked pounds of both...i have never bought the argument that either one contained Perique.

    Posted 4 years ago #
  3. judcole

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    Nor did I.

    Posted 4 years ago #
  4. leacha

    leacha

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    There is member here that is allergic to perique. Send him a sample and the truth will be known.

    Posted 4 years ago #
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    tppytel

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    HOTW does say "a pure Virginian tobacco" right on the can, for what that's worth. I've got a can open right now and have smoked pounds of the stuff over the years. I've never considered it a VAPer. It wouldn't surprise me if there's actually a touch of it in there, but the overall effect is nothing like Escudo, St. James Flake, etc.

    It's been a while since I've smoked Old Gowrie, but I don't remember anything Perique-like in it at all. Definitely a straight VA.

    Posted 4 years ago #
  6. crazypipe

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    I do not like Perique, never have

    Posted 4 years ago #
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    billypm

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    I'm not sure about the Perique, but I sure can taste the Kentucky in Brown Clunee. And while I used to like Old Gowrie, I sure don't now. So I'm voting for neither of those two, at least, being a straight Va.

    Posted 4 years ago #
  8. melvinsunsmokedcastello

    melvinsunsmokedcastello

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    "Having smoked pounds of both...i have never bought the argument that either one contained Perique."

    This. I havent smoked pounds but I smoked more then a few tins of both..never tasted Perique. These are straight VA.

    Samuel Gawith/Gawith & Hoggarth rope and plug junkie..
    Posted 4 years ago #
  9. sothron

    Perique

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    I do not like Perique, never have

    And yet I've always been fond of you.

    Posted 4 years ago #
  10. mawnansmiff

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    Perhaps an old thread but reading it got me thinking, particularly about HOTW. My tin bought about a month ago clearly states on the back...

    "HOTW is an unusually strong Virginia based mixture. Fire cured Kentucky is added to a base of a variety of Virginias and Perique completes this mixture. It is then pressed and finally rubbed by hand - a broken flake in a class of its own"

    So there we have it, HOTW does indeed contain Perique! As for my tin of Old Gowrie, it tells me nothing of the contents.

    FWIW my tin of Brown Clunee lists its contents as "...Kentucky, Perique and dark rubbed Virginia".

    I hope someone finds this useful.

    Regards,

    Jay.

    ...take up thy stethoscope and walk...
    Posted 2 years ago #
  11. jiminks

    JimInks

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    Perique is listed on my tin of Old Gowrie, too.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  12. mawnansmiff

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    So there we have it then! It make me wonder about those who claim to have smoked pounds of the stuff yet not noticed the Perique in it

    Regards,

    Jay.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  13. jackswilling

    jackswilling

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    Old Gowrie = "Kentucky, Perique, and Virginia."

    "Had his shooting been as good as his running, he might have given a better account of himself."
    James. C. Henderson
    Posted 2 years ago #
  14. cosmicfolklore

    Cosmic

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    Some folks cannot taste the cinnamon in an apple pie over the flavors of apples, nor taste the cinnamon in a cinnamon bun, most likely because they relate the taste of cinnamon to that of red hots or stronger doses of cinnamon. This may be what is happening here. The condemental leaf is used very sparingly to sweeten the tobacco, and they cannot taste it over the Virginia. Or, maybe they are associating perique with Escudo or Bayou Morning, and they don"t understand how different amounts of perique affects the flavor differently. Plus, perique doesn't have a flavor of its on per se. It's like salt. What does salt taste like? Pure salt is different tasting than just a sprinkle over your beans. And, a sprinkle over beans is different than a sprinkle over chicken.
    It's an elusive flavor for sure, and probably confuses some folks.

    Michael
    Posted 2 years ago #
  15. mawnansmiff

    mawnansmiff

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    Cosmic, I appreciate what you're saying but some folks were quite adamant there was no perique in the blends. Not prepared to say "well if it's in there I can't taste it". Nobody likes to be wrong but occasionally we all can be.

    Regards,

    Jay.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  16. cosmicfolklore

    Cosmic

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    ...just like Kevin, the owner of this forum and magazine, reporting that Escudo and Dunhill Navy Rolls are made on the same assembly line with the same ingredients, and there are still people who say they taste a difference. I am not saying that they don't taste a difference, nor that there is nor isn't a difference, just interesting.

    Being right or wrong, who cares, smoke what you like, like what you smoke. Fiddle-faddle over ingredients or who knows more than someone else is just ego juice, and no one wants to get somneone else's juice on them.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  17. mawnansmiff

    mawnansmiff

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    "Being right or wrong, who cares,..."

    I care and I care very much when someone gives me information that is incorrect. There are so many myths, fables and outright lies told on these forums by folks who really should know better. Though still a relative newbie in piping I am slowly beginning to pick up on these myths etc. If something doesn't sound right then chances are it isn't right.

    I would be mortified if I were to come on here and tell everyone emphatically that X blend contains Y tobacco only to find out that it didn't. I suppose we just have different standards.

    Regards,

    Jay.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  18. ashdigger

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    Here, let me help out......OGS contains a boat-load of perique......and by BOAT-LOAD, I mean none. Discuss.

    Ubi Ignis Est?
    Posted 2 years ago #
  19. mawnansmiff

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    Never had the stuff chum.

    Regards,

    Jay.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  20. andrew

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    https://socalpipester.files.wordpress.com/2014/01/rattrays_booklet.pdf Here is the booklet and it does state it's all Va but I think the booklet is outdated as on the K&K website it lists kentucky, va, and perique. Either way it's a good blend and Rattray's should admit that the booklet is more of a souvenir than fact. I can't taste much perique in OG so it could be similar to how it's used in Orlik Golden Sliced.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  21. cosmicfolklore

    Cosmic

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    I've always said that if there is any perique in OGS, then it was wasted. It just makes my skin crawl to hear someone say that OGS is a VaPer, because it is not a very good example of a VaPer, nor is Old Gowrie for that matter. So, if it's in there, does it matter?

    Posted 2 years ago #
  22. jackswilling

    jackswilling

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    From the K&K current web site for Old Gowrie
    "Exquisite, dark Virginia, Kentucky and a touch of Perique intervene in the press up to 3 months, then cut and ground by hand."

    http://kohlhase-kopp.com/ceemes/?article/search/0/category=20/__boolop__=AND/destination=228:results/__layout__=533/ex_creferenz_marke=681/__export__=781/ref_pfeifentabak

    Posted 2 years ago #
  23. cortezattic

    Cortez

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    I've been smoking VaPers and Perique-forward blends for so long now that I just don't notice the Perique in blends
    where it is only used as a subtle modifier; and perhaps HotW and Old Gowrie are such blends.

    As for OGS, this controversy came up a few years ago when Kevin was talking to Troels Mikkelsen of Orlik.
    Kevin mentioned that the square tins of OGS listed Burley as one of the components, but that he didn't taste it.
    Troels said that the tin description is incorrect. OGS has Perique, not Burley -- and that is what Kevin didn't taste!

    You can read about it in Kevin's article, Orlik Golden Sliced Update - No Burley, Yes Perique.

    I find myself sitting idly on the line dividing past and future,
    as if I could kill time without injuring eternity. -- Thoreau
    Posted 2 years ago #
  24. cosmicfolklore

    Cosmic

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    Yes Cortez, but would you suggest OGS to someone who is interested in perique? I would't. I would suggest something that actually had the flavor compounded by the condiment in a way that perique was known for.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  25. philobeddoe

    Philo Beddoe

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    I have smoked many, many tins of Old Gowrie and have never tasted Perique. I suppose it all part of the blenders art, the Perique fills in some note of the flavor spectrum that would feel missed were the Perique not there.

    "So it goes." - K.V.
    Posted 2 years ago #
  26. mawnansmiff

    mawnansmiff

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    "It just makes my skin crawl to hear someone say that OGS is a VaPer, because it is not..."

    "Being right or wrong, who cares,..."

    Contradictory statements I would say Cosmic. And evidently you care too else your skin wouldn't crawl.

    Regards,

    Jay.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  27. yaddy306

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    "It just makes my skin crawl to hear someone say that OGS is a VaPer, because it is not..."

    "Being right or wrong, who cares,..."

    Contradictory statements I would say Cosmic. And evidently you care too else your skin wouldn't crawl.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  28. cosmicfolklore

    Cosmic

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    You're trying to put meanings to my words, damn you, ha ha.
    I meant to hear OGS suggested as a VaPer to someone who is perique curious... as the person will not taste the perique... & Not caring that a blend I am smoking contains perique if I don't taste the perique doesn't throw out any philosophical vortexes of doom for me. Ha ha.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  29. cosmicfolklore

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    Some days words just flow for me, and others... me no use good words.

    Posted 2 years ago #

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