As many of you may know I'm a carpenter of ten years. I have recently become unemployed, much to do with the recent state of the economy. I received an e-mail from a certain lawn care products company about possible employment. I returned the e-mail expressing my interest in any job openings they may have. Shortly after replying to the e-mail I received a call from a representative of the company. He started to go over the details of the job including hours and the characteristics of what one would have to do. The next question out of his mouth was "do you use tobacco products?" My response was yes. He said then you would have to quit using tobacco for ten days and call me back. I said NO I will not. I don't think this is something I would be interested in. I then said how does tobacco use affect the way one can perform their job? To no response, I guess you are not supposed to question why you shouldn't be able to use tobacco products. In my opinion this is a sad time in our country when tobacco use in lumped in the same category as drugs and alcohol to disqualify from getting a job. I for one will no longer use this companies products and anyone interested in the brand names of this company can send me a private message. I will be more than happy to tell you who they are.
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Pipes Magazine » General Discussion
MAD AS HELL
(28 posts)-
Posted 2 years ago #
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Sorry to hear it, Sap. Frakin hippies.
Posted 2 years ago # -
That is infuriating. Keep private whatever you want to, but I think we should start composing a public listing of companies that are unfriendly to tobacco and boycott them all.
We do have a substantial and growing audience on this site, and I am certainly for telling all of our viewers information like this.
Posted 2 years ago # -
Your the boss, didn't know how it would go over if I mentioned it. I do feel your right, perhaps a thread where members can add such ridiculous companies. He's one to start: Scott's lawn care products including miracle grow.
Posted 2 years ago # -
Oh yeah, Kevin I wanted to mention how well I think your quote of the day fits this situation.
Posted 2 years ago # -
Anonymous
Unregistered
Posts: 1,616offlineLogin to Send PM
That's JACKED UP!...
Posted 2 years ago # -
There go my plastic flowers
Posted 2 years ago # -
That really sucks Sapo. My prayers to you that you will be back working soon. I can’t believe that decision like this can be made by a company based on statistical bullshit.
I’m no scientist but I think I’ve read enough of the counter studies to know that what they push as fact, is fiction at best. It’s happening with more and more companies so I’m all for seeing a place to call out those businesses because they will never get another dollar from me.
Posted 2 years ago # -
Maybe they're worried that you'll try to free-base the pesticides or something. Don't they contain high doses of nicotine?
Posted 2 years ago # -
sapo59 - Oh yeah, Kevin I wanted to mention how well I think your quote of the day fits this situation.
Let's place here before it disappears and we have to wait for it to come back in the rotation:
It amazes me of what little intelligence, and narrow-mindedness so many people have with their attitudes that we need to be protected from ourselves and not be allowed to make our own lifestyle decisions. Perhaps people of this type of thinking are the ones that need protecting from themselves, and the rest of us only need protecting from them. Kevin, owner of PipesMagazine.com
Posted 2 years ago # -
Scotts has been in the news for this. I think I saw something about this on Forces. Cant' find it without digging.
Anyway here's a related story.
These hiring practices are legal in at will states.(about half of them).
I think it sucks you lost out on the job Sapo. And I question the business rationale behind the position. But I do support the right of workers and employers to function "at will" in the employment relationship. If an employer chooses to hire only smokers, or no smokers, no guys with earnings or only guys with earrings or whatever I support the right...if not the narrowness of the point of view.
Again, seems dumb to me...significantly reduces your potential employee pool and more likely to piss off your tobacco and liberty supporting customers than it is to breed good will with the extreme anti-tobacco element.
I wonder what's worse for the "children".... adult tobacco use or spraying suburban lawns with chemicals so potentially dangerous that they aren't even available without a license?
Again Sapo I'm sorry the job didn't work out. I've been unemployed before myself. But hang in. I bet a month or so from now you'll be saying "damn I'm glad I didn't get that job". Always seems like things work out for the best in the long term.
And I will not be conducting business with Scott's or buying their products. They have a right to a policy and I have a right to vote with my wallet.
I won't see any communication directed to me here. I'm no longer active at this forum.Posted 2 years ago # -
Jonesing, I see the point of choosing who you hire. I would never want to be on a job building a house or scaffolds with someone intoxicated or high, just never thought I'd be lumped into the same category for using tobacco.
Posted 2 years ago # -
jonesing,
And I will not be conducting business with Scott's or buying their products. They have a right to a policy and I have a right to vote with my wallet.
I'm with you 100% in that philosophy.I find myself sitting idly on the line dividing past and future,
as if I could kill time without injuring eternity. -- ThoreauPosted 2 years ago # -
sapo59 I hate to hear that but I know what you mean, I am a carpenter I have only made it working for myself doing handyman work, I have had the same thing happen when i looked for work with larger companies, all i can say is stand your ground and I feel for you.
Posted 2 years ago # -
Sorry for your misfortune Sapo. I'll not bother to echo what many others in here have said better than I could on the matter. Best wishes to you.
Posted 2 years ago # -
Sapo said
Jonesing, I see the point of choosing who you hire. I would never want to be on a job building a house or scaffolds with someone intoxicated or high, just never thought I'd be lumped into the same category for using tobacco.
Ain't it sad?
Leaps of fuzzy logic.
Frankly, I'm a little surprised that smokers don't pay higher share of company provided health benes. Not saying they should, because I'm not convinced smokers are any more or less healthy than people who are overweight, heavy drinkers, inactive, etc. etc. But I'm still surprised.
Anyway...glad you understand that my thoughts on the legality of at will employment is in no way an endorsement of Scotts policy or an indication of anything but sincerely being "MAD AS HELL" right along with ya.
Good on ya brother. I'll think good thoughts in your direction.
Posted 2 years ago # -
Anonymous
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Posts: 159offlineLogin to Send PM
I find it difficult to believe that this "at will" hiring ethos exists at all. Qualifications are just that; anything else is some kind of social discrimination, as the professor rightly points out in the linked article. Have we not learnt enough from the slave trade? Or the women's rights movements? Or again during the civil rights movements?
I have no idea if their products are marketed over this side of the pond sir, but I'll join the boycott if I can.
Regards.Posted 2 years ago # -
I read quite a bit of military history, and there are theories that nicotine enhances the abilities of dead tired soldiers to do their job. It also suppresses the appetite of hungry soldiers. That is why the allies made sure soldiers had tobacco in WW1 and WW2. Tobacco could have played a part in keeping The Axis powers from taking the world. It is just a theory. No disrespect to the brave soldiers of those wars.
Posted 2 years ago # -
Thanks for all the comments guys. I don't want anyone to feel sorry for me by no means. I have been out of work before, the last few years have been a rough time in this trade. I just thought I'd share my angry about not even being considered for a job because of tobacco use.
Posted 2 years ago # -
I am amazed to discover that it it legal to refuse to hire someone because they choose to smoke. I can see an employer refusing to allow smoking on his property, but what people do away from work obviously should not be considered in their employment qualifications! I don't think you would have been happy working for an outfit as scrogged up as that one anyway. Keep the faith.
Posted 2 years ago # -
I feel your pain Sapo,
The line I keep getting, is "Your over qualified" meaning they don't want someone who can benefit the company.
So, I guess that you can add educated, to the list.
Smokers, alcoholics, drug abusers and the educated... what's next?The Khmer Rouge murdered people who wore glasses, because they were supposed to be smart.
Just goes to show you what paranoia and misinformation can do.Posted 2 years ago # -
I have found a number of companies who provide an insurance plan for their employees using "lower rates" as an excuse for this. And yes, it is an excuse; period.
My thinking is that if they can't get you to see things their way with a lame argument, they are going to force you into submission through the wallet. I dont blame you a bit for being pissed over this Sapo.
BTW, I had seen something about Scott's doing this a couple of years ago and have not used anything associated with the brand since.
Posted 2 years ago # -
As soon as I started reading your post, I knew it was Scott's. They started this policy a few years ago and I have said screw Scott's ever since.
It is not just smokers that they refuse to hire and will fire, it's all tobacco users. They give random drug test to all of their employees for nicotine. If an employee has nicotine in their system, Scott's will terminate them.
"When the Government Fears the People, There is Liberty;
When the People Fear the Government, There is Tyranny." - Thomas JeffersonPosted 2 years ago # -
I wanted to inform everyone I am starting a boycott thread in the General discussion section. I will include this company, and ask anyone to feel free to add anti-tobacco and smoker companies such as Scott's to the list. Happy Puffing and ENJOY.
Posted 2 years ago # -
...but what people do away from work obviously should not be considered in their employment qualifications!
Amen to that!Period!
Speaking of removing links to make the chain shorter, as soon as people started pissing into cups to get a job -- which is more a test of conformity than anything else -- it was only another step to this.
There was a day when it was valid to ask workers about their race & religion to deny them work. It's just been modulated to a different key now.
If someone can satisfy the requirements of their job, then it doesn't matter one fart what they do on their free time. This is just a different kind of loyalty test, one based on lifestyle instead of belief, and is just as much an infringement on one's freedom.
But as soon as people started pissing into cups without complaint -- which is an invasion of privacy, as well as signifying the employer has a right to tell what you can do with your own body, thus giving up some claim to ownership of your own body -- then this is the next step.
I'm sorry, sapo59. Totally sucks. Fuck Scotts.
There's nothing quite like tobacco: it's the passion of decent folk, and whoever lives without tobacco doesn't deserve to live.
-MolierePosted 2 years ago # -
They charge to damn much any way .I always buy the bargin brand and it makes my yard so thick you have to mow it every week . Keep the faith and a new job will come your way . I have always found it best to seek out who does the hiring and talk to them directly ,if they do not hire you .Ask them to help you network to find a job .
“There was an awful suspicion in my mind that I'd finally gone over the hump, and the worst thing about it was that I didn't feel tragic at all, but only weary, and sort of comfortably detached.”Posted 2 years ago # -
Overqualified! I am over fifty hence I am overqualified. I smoke hence I am undesirable. I have a bad back hence I am a risk to their precious insurance plans. Seems like a never ending spiral to me!
If at first you don't succeed you are running about average.Posted 2 years ago # -
Sapo, Don't you know,or didn't you get the memo. The American people are all stupid. The government and company management know whats best for you. Do what they say without question and like it. Amazing how much has changed in such a short amount of time.
NASCAR...Everything else is just a game.Posted 2 years ago #
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