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Is Dunhill Really Going to Stop All Tobacco Production?

(72 posts)
  1. mcitinner1

    mcitinner1

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    I know that everyone has said Dunhill is stopping production, and I see that several of the blends are unavailable online, but some of them are still very available. I've been buying Dark Flake to stock up.

    Stan
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    The Plenipotent Key to Cope's Correct Card of the Peerless Pilgrimage to Saint Nicotine of the Holy Herb:
    Posted 6 months ago #
  2. ssjones

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    It's been pretty well documented that they have ceased production. It appears that many vendors have uncovered some stashes of certain blends. Unfortunately, MM965 is not in that group, at least not that I've found.

    Al

    Posted 6 months ago #
  3. 3rdguy

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    Rumor is that STG is going to be producing them in 2019 under new names.

    Posted 6 months ago #
  4. ernieq

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    Yeah, they've quit. Not every supplier runs out at once, and in my recent experience Dark flake wasn't a great seller (as good as it is) so there's still some available if you look around. EMP, Nightcap etc...went fast. Navy Rolls is still available in places if you look.

    In Europe, Robert McConnell has clone blends under similar names available (Night Club etc...). There are industry rumors that these will eventually be coming stateside, but the FDA is holding things up. No word on their accuracy/quality yet.

    Posted 6 months ago #
  5. sablebrush52

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    In Europe, Robert McConnell has clone blends under similar names available (Night Club etc...). There are industry rumors that these will eventually be coming stateside, but the FDA is holding things up. No word on their accuracy/quality yet.

    From the reviews I've seem they're quality blends, but not the same as the STG product. For example, the McConnell Navy Rolls version has Cavendish in it, and the Royal Yacht version has less topping.

    It is better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to open one's mouth and remove all doubt. - Mark Twain

    It is pointless to argue with a fanatic since a dim bulb can't be converted into a searchlight. - Jesse Silver
    Posted 6 months ago #
  6. donjgiles

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    I have read the similarities of the new "Navy Rolls" and Luxury Bullseye Flake are rather apparent, sounds like rebranding to me.

    Posted 6 months ago #
  7. unkleyoda

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    I have read the similarities of the new "Navy Rolls" and Luxury Bullseye Flake are rather apparent, sounds like rebranding to me.

    That would be odd, seeing as STG makes PS LBF and K&K makes the McConnell 'Dunhill Clones'.


    So you say you can drink? Well, I'm from Wisconsin. Try to keep up.
    Posted 6 months ago #
  8. woodsroad

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    What’s all this then about Dunhill???
    And did you hear the the Nazis surrendered?

    Posted 6 months ago #
  9. ashdigger

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    Wasn't Dunhill one of the dudes on the Mayflower?

    Ubi Ignis Est?
    Posted 6 months ago #
  10. woodsroad

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    No, he was one of the guys in the Mayfair Madam’s little black book.

    Posted 6 months ago #
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    foursidedtriangle

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    Yes Dunhill is mostly gone, there is a copycat line of tobaccos getting produced in Europe but of course they are not a replica.

    Posted 6 months ago #
  12. madox07

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    Search for the Robert McConnel replicas, this is the only for sure thing for now.

    Sea Wolf Pipers

    "Like the mariners of old, a loner is acceptable but a pipe is best enjoyed in a pack"
    Posted 6 months ago #
  13. ernieq

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    I have read the similarities of the new "Navy Rolls" and Luxury Bullseye Flake are rather apparent, sounds like rebranding to me.

    Open up a tin of Escudo and a tin of Navy Rolls. Look at them side by side and smoke them. Unless you have two tins of drastically different age or "Super Spidey Sense" i'd wager you couldn't tell the difference. Luxury Bullseye has Cavendish in the center. I'm fairly certain it's a different blend.
    E.

    Posted 6 months ago #
  14. slowwideturns

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    First mcclelland and now this? Dunhill tobacco's were most of my favorites. Time to start stockpiling I guess. What is the world coming to?

    j.k. livin'... the j's for just the k's for keep
    Posted 6 months ago #
  15. unkleyoda

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    First mcclelland and now this? Dunhill tobacco's were most of my favorites. Time to start stockpiling I guess. What is the world coming to?

    Man, you're kinda late to the dance. I've been stockpiling for a year+. Most stock at retailers is gone already.

    Posted 6 months ago #
  16. slowwideturns

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    I keep quite a bit around, and my local b&m still has a lot. It looks like I'm paying them a visit soon and dropping some serious cash haha

    Posted 6 months ago #
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    foursidedtriangle

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    While you are there get HH Vintage Syrian that one is gone as well.

    Posted 6 months ago #
  18. judcole

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    I have assembled a nice little stash of my fave Dunhill blends. Since the ones I am fondest of were not the most popular,I had no trouble assembling my stash a year or so ago. (I had been cellaring Flake for years.)
    Some of the blends that were recently reintroduced to the states - Dark Flake, MM 1938,Ye Olde Signe, among others - are still readily available.

    Thought in the early morning, solace in time of woes,
    Peace in the hush of the twilight, balm ere my eyelids close
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    Posted 6 months ago #
  19. jacks6

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    Ye Olde Sign is a sleeper in the line. Killer blend.

    Posted 6 months ago #
  20. jacks6

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    Also agree about Dark Flake

    Posted 6 months ago #
  21. woodsroad

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    FWIW, "Dunhill" hasn't produced any pipe tobacco in decades.

    Posted 6 months ago #
  22. npod

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    Dunhill as a legal entity is fully out of the tobacco business. The last legal action was to dissolve the use of the Dunhill name on pipes. The pipe brand is now "White Spot" and the tobacco labeling (and tobacco production) has been terminated. A much-admired UK label, Dunhill has laboured through the past decade with changing designers, management teams and a general lack of focus. That era, however, suddenly appears to be very much over. They are now squarely focused on "British" luxury in the global market, specifically China.

    Dunhill is currently focused on luxury golf and estate wear.

    They have a long way to go. They are not even in the top 20 global luxury brands by sales. Think about HOW SMALL the pipe and tobacco revenue would be in this pool. I surely would ditch the baccy.

    Dunhill pipes are called White Spot now. But they can use the moniker, "Alfred Dunhill's White Spot."

    Dunhill tobacco (the use of the name on tobacco) is gone.

    Neal
    Posted 6 months ago #
  23. cosmicfolklore

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    ^^+1 Npod, for the years that we have been waiting on Dunhill to halt all pipe wares, I have been surprised at how guys have held on to the previous marketing brainwashing of this company. It's been like watching someone come out and piss on their brainwashed fans and berate them, and the fans all laughing with giddiness, that they were lucky enough to get pissed on.
    Screw Dunhill for turning their backs on the pipe industry that made the name famous. Screw those new blends obviously released mediocre swill that was meant to make a last fling of as dime off of the idiots that praise that name.
    Screw the Dunhill colognes, body washes, after shaves, marketed to these non-smoking elitist... pencil necks.

    You guys can gather up these over-priced crumbs strewn by these fair-weather friends. I hope their colognes and wallets, and belts give their customers gout and leprosy.

    Michael
    Posted 6 months ago #
  24. timt

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    I hope their colognes and wallets, and belts give their customers gout and leprosy.

    Haha, tell us how you really feel. Lately I've been trying to decide on what pipe maker to go to for a "nice" pipe. Dunhill use to be a consideration but for a lot of the reasons you guys have mentioned and now a fear of leprosy, I'm thinking Castello.

    Tim
    Posted 6 months ago #
  25. chasingembers

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    Weren't the last "Dunhill" pipes made in 2011?

    Damnation seize my soul if I give you quarters, or take any from you.
    -Edward Teach
    Posted 6 months ago #
  26. cosmicfolklore

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    Castello is an awesome pipemaker. There are actually a lot of very good pipe companies and makers that haven't been gouging their customers by over-pricing their pipes. Lately, with the new White Spots, I have seen more complaints posted about them now, more-so than with their pre-name change pipes. And, if British pipes is your thing, then take a look at some of the other makers, especially Northern Briars. Ian makes a marvelous pipe and charges a modest penny.

    Posted 6 months ago #
  27. ashdigger

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    This thread reminds me that I really enjoy Dunhill Flake in a pre-1967 Dunhill pipe.

    Posted 6 months ago #
  28. timt

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    I have to admit that a birthyear '66 Dunhill would be tempting. I just don't see hardly any anywhere. There's a bent bulldog on Smokingpipes but it's pricey - at least IMO.

    Posted 6 months ago #
  29. npod

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    With all that said, I did manage to stock up many pounds of Nightcap, EMP, and RY.

    And I will never smoke my Root-Lovat-Blum, Dunhill Root Briar 40 4R Lovat (1962) pipe. This rare beauty is an offering for the pipe Gods.

    Posted 6 months ago #
  30. timt

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    That's a beauty. Unsmoked?

    Posted 6 months ago #
  31. npod

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    Yep, unsmoked.

    Posted 6 months ago #
  32. woodsroad

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    Dunhill tobacco (the use of the name on tobacco) is gone.
    Au contraire, mon ami.

    Posted 6 months ago #
  33. timt

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    Yep, unsmoked. [:lol:]

    You've got some willpower I must say. I'd have to hide it somewhere to resist.

    Posted 6 months ago #
  34. warren

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    These Dunhill, dunhill and Dunhill White Spot threads are always entertaining. Rarely edifying, but, always entertaining.

    A man without a shillelagh is a man without an expedient.
    Posted 6 months ago #
  35. bluegrasspipe

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    I have heard a lot of smack talk from both sides regarding dunhill pipes over the years on this forum. I had to buy one to decide for myself, and I bought one from Bruce (Foggymountain) and I have to admit it is far from my favorite briar.
    The dunhill tobacco I have stocked my favorites slowly in my cellar for about 1 1/2 years now, and I am glad I did.

    For tho' at my simile many may joke,
    Man is but a pipe—and his life but smoke.
    Posted 6 months ago #
  36. woodsroad

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    Rarely edifying, but, always entertaining
    Then let me ed-ify it a bit:

    Posted 6 months ago #
  37. cosmicfolklore

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    Posted 6 months ago #
  38. warren

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    Oh, oh! Someone is going to fake offense.

    Posted 6 months ago #
  39. slowwideturns

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    Orlik makes their tobacco right? If so I would assume they'll rename the blends and still sell them?

    Posted 5 months ago #
  40. 3rdguy

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    STG

    Posted 5 months ago #
  41. rmpeeps

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    Posted 5 months ago #
  42. lordofthepiperings

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    I've heard that STG will still produce the blends, same recipes and same leaf supply, under new names in 2019. I'm sure we'll get a flood of, "This new stuff ain't as good as the old stuff we had back in 2009.". I think more people need to be glad for what they have and appreciate it instead of comparing it to a lost product.

    "The thinking man always smokes a Peterson." -Peterson of Dublin
    Posted 5 months ago #
  43. jvnshr

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    Dan, Dunhill doesn't use tobacco in their cigarettes. End of story.

    Javan
    Posted 5 months ago #
  44. warren

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    And the stuff back in 2009 was different from the same stuff back in '66. Tobacco leaf morphs continuously as does the dirt it grows in. the rain which falls on it and all the other variables involved in growing and production. Now. as to better or worse? That depends on your constantly changing palate. Remember the "Great War Horse Debate?" A waste of space and really a great. amusing waste of time to read. No one palate stays the same over a number of years. The same can be said of one's memory. And, a "cellared" tobacco will also change over time. I believe that's the goal of some who store a blend over the years. The hope it will be even better in taste. Depending on their palate ... it's a crap shoot.

    I know some of my chosen blends taste the same to me over the years as the subtle changes aren't really noted. I can go back to a blend I haven't smoked in years and the new generation may bear no resemblance to the memory. I write that off to my palate and the changes in leaf and manufacturing.

    Posted 5 months ago #
  45. sablebrush52

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    Going back to the title of this thread, Dunhill stopped producing tobacco blends almost 40 years ago. Production was outsourced to Murrays and, apparently, McConnell when they still existed. Murrays simplified some of the blends, removing some aging and fermenting steps, and swapping out some components, to make them less costly to make. Each succeeding maker changes tobacco components and processing. The only apparent constant is the name. In a very real sense, these are Dunhill tobaccos in name only.

    None of this matters if you like the resulting blend. So if BAT has made a deal with STG to use the recipes under another name, you will still have access to these Dunhill branded blends, even if the name is now gone.

    From what I've read, the "McConnell" products are K&K takes on Dunhill-like blends. These may be fine blends in their own right. But when all is said and done, Dunhill tobaccos went out of production almost 40 years ago.

    Posted 5 months ago #
  46. slowwideturns

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    I agree, this line is way too popular to just go away.

    Posted 5 months ago #
  47. unkleyoda

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    I've heard that STG will still produce the blends, same recipes and same leaf supply, under new names in 2019.

    I hope so, I love the stuff.

    Posted 5 months ago #
  48. warren

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    I've heard that STG will still produce the blends, same recipes and same leaf supply, under new names in 2019.

    Who did you "hear" that from? Somebody who would have firsthand knowledge? If so ask how many millions of dollars were paid for the rights to use such. I'm very interested in the financials.

    Posted 5 months ago #
  49. metalheadycigarguy

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    I've heard that STG will still produce the blends, same recipes and same leaf supply, under new names in 2019.

    Who did you "hear" that from? Somebody who would have firsthand knowledge? If so ask how many millions of dollars were paid for the rights to use such. I'm very interested in the financials.

    I asked a very well versed person at the West Coast Pipe Show about the possibility of STG continuing to blend the Dunhill tobacco's with a new name and new tin. This individual is a member of a very well known tobacco family, that's been blending and producing tobacco's for a very long time and is definitely in the know. This individual is a 5th generation member of the family (hint), and he stated that unless something falls through at the last moment you'll more likely than not see STG producing the current Dunhill tobaccos in 2019, new tin and new art. Just sit back and be patient your favorite Dunhill blends will reappear in 2019.

    I posted a video about it on my YT channel about a week ago.

    Posted 5 months ago #
  50. blendtobac

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    A company owns the rights to their name, but the blender's company owns the blends. So if STG wants to continue making the tobaccos under a different name, they're entitled to. You can't trademark or patent a blend any more than a chef can do so to a recipe.

    Russ

    Posted 5 months ago #
  51. jpmcwjr

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    Would that change in name and tin art allow the FDA to ban it until the company had paid up and given them $$$ to "test" the blend? It shouldn't be that way, and maybe it isn't, hence the question.

    I know that you believe you understood what you think I said, but I'm not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant.
    Posted 5 months ago #
  52. cosmicfolklore

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    What we seem to keep hearing about the FDA rules, and what we see happening in the real word, doesn't seem to coincide. If they release them under a new name, we should just be happy, without giving the horse's mouth the once over. IMO

    Posted 5 months ago #
  53. jpmcwjr

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    Not suggesting we have reason to check out the horse's chompers! It's the FDA that may or may not piss in the pool.

    Posted 5 months ago #
  54. cosmicfolklore

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    Well, C&D, Sutliff, and Lane seem to be pulling new blends out of thin air each week. Maybe they will all disappear on the magic day, or not. Who knows what lurks ahead? The FDA could be rolled into the EPA and be taken over by the YMCA by that time. Unlikely... but...

    Posted 5 months ago #
  55. npod

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    The FDA could be rolled into the EPA and be taken over by the YMCA by that time

    Ah yes, the epic battle of the EPA vs YMCA. Hey, don't mess with the YMCA crew, those dudes are bad ass and they fight dirty.

    Posted 5 months ago #
  56. warren

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    Russ: thanks for that. My feeble mind never made the jump of food to tobacco recipes.

    metalhead: That's the info I was more or less looking for. Thanks.

    Posted 5 months ago #
  57. sablebrush52

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    What we seem to keep hearing about the FDA rules, and what we see happening in the real word, doesn't seem to coincide. If they release them under a new name, we should just be happy, without giving the horse's mouth the once over. IMO

    There was a workaround. Record a sale of a blend prior to 8/8/16 and no need to go through the deeming process prior to offering it for sale in the marketplace. Nothing to stop any blender from making a "sale" of potentially hundreds of blends and then using those blanks as needed. As for 8/8/21? That's pretty clear. Deem or die.

    Posted 5 months ago #
  58. ashdigger

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    "Deem or Die"? That'll go right under my "Join or Die" tattoo.

    If the space deems appropriate.

    Posted 5 months ago #
  59. cosmicfolklore

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    There was a workaround. Record a sale of a blend prior to 8/8/16 and no need to go through the deeming process prior to offering it for sale in the marketplace. Nothing to stop any blender from making a "sale" of potentially hundreds of blends and then using those blanks as needed. As for 8/8/21? That's pretty clear. Deem or die.

    When talking to Mr. Stokkebye at The Briary about this and their cigar named blends... he said, forum talk is bullshit to me," :::big smile:::, "the laws are still being interpreted."

    So, really, I would place my faith in the companies, and not the many armchair lawyers we have on the forum that keep telling us what the rules are.

    Posted 5 months ago #
  60. woodsroad

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    The lawyers aren't nearly as entertaining, though.

    Posted 5 months ago #
  61. brian64

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    what we see happening in the real word, doesn't seem to coincide.

    It's generally inadvisable these days to attempt interpreting the real world without legal counsel.

    “Bipartisan usually means some larger-than-usual deception is being carried out.” – George Carlin
    Posted 5 months ago #
  62. sablebrush52

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    So, really, I would place my faith in the companies, and not the many armchair lawyers we have on the forum that keep telling us what the rules are.

    So would I. That workaround was imparted to me by people in the trade, not on a forum.

    Posted 5 months ago #
  63. bnichols23

    Bill Nichols

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    Dunhill? Ain't that what bubba said about 2 minutes after he crossed his skis on the black diamond slope??

    Head Black Frigate keelhauler, boss powder monkey, & troublemaker 1st class.
    Posted 5 months ago #
  64. metalheadycigarguy

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    metalhead: That's the info I was more or less looking for. Thanks.

    You're welcome! Just trying to save people the headache of having to hunt down their favorite Dunhill blend before the online shops and B&M shops are completely out of stock, and save on the pocket book from those inflated prices on the secondary market.

    Posted 5 months ago #
  65. ssjones

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    Stopped by JB Hayes today in VA. Bought the last of their bulk MM 965 and Matt Hayes gave me the bulk bag package sticker. Sad.

    Posted 3 months ago #
  66. raevans

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    Stopped by JB Hayes today in VA.

    I haven't seen Matt in about nine months. How is he doing as far as his house blend tobaccos, (Tom's Red and Black, Scottish Moor, etc.)? I know that most of them were based with McClelland tobaccos and was wondering if he found another source.

    Posted 3 months ago #
  67. ssjones

    ssjones

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    @raevans - he didn't mention any other bulk troubles, but definitely was bemoaning the challenge of getting tins these days.

    Posted 3 months ago #
  68. raevans

    raevans

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    I can remember at the Fair Oaks store, we had so many tins that we didn't know what to do with them all. We had them in the store, across the hall in out cigar storage area and at an offsite room on the other side of the mall. If we only knew then what we know now.

    Posted 3 months ago #
  69. maxsmoke

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    As a new pipe smoker I am disappointed at the news. I very much enjoy their Early Morning & Night Cap blends . Are there comparables that can be recommended?

    Posted 3 months ago #
  70. gerryp

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    I keep picturing the old Japanese soldier who's been marooned on a deserted Pacific island since 1945.

    Posted 3 months ago #

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