I love my Virginia flakes but I have to limit how much I smoke them as they really bite me. Will aging my Virginias mellow them out so they will bite less?
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Pipes Magazine » Pipe Tobacco Discussion
Aging Virginia Flakes Question
(25 posts)-
Posted 4 months ago #
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Aging (we're talking YEARS here, not months) will certainly mellow and sweeten virginias considerably. But the process is extremely gradual.
Experts say noticeable changes occur at 6 months to a year, then at 2 years, 5 years, 10 years, 20 years, and 30 years of aging.
So yes, one should notice the improvements you're asking about, with the resultant reductions in sharpness and bite, after 7-10 years of proper aging.
More details are available on line. Here's a couple:
Such as from Greg Pease http://www.glpease.com/FAQ.html#AGE
From the PT Academy http://www.talkingtobacco.com/2012/07/pipe-tobacco-academy-aging-pipe-tobacco/
Posted 4 months ago # -
Thanks rothnh. I will crack a tin a year from now and see if there are any improvements. If not, I will wait 2-5 yrs and so on. In the mean time I will take it easy. I have discovered that I can smoke burley/virginia flakes and most English with no problems. I wonder if I spray my virginias with some kind of alkali substance, such as baking soda disolved distilled water and allow it to dry if that could help neutralize the acidity without changing the flavor. I am in the mood for experimentation!
Posted 4 months ago # -
Fresh VA flakes bite me too, I smoke them in a p-lip Pete and keep it slow, no problems
Aging will take it away, and make the smoke sublime, but as stated it takes a few years. IMO one year doesn't do it..3-5 doesThe most important things in life are good friends and a good bullpen...not necessarily in that orderPosted 4 months ago # -
Flyguy,
Assuming the aging is done properly, you should notice some rather small improvements earlier, but the reality of life is the changes that you seek will not materialize for 7-10 years or more. Sorry. And remember, every time you crack a jar open, the aging process restarts from scratch after you reseal that jar -- Oh well, maybe you can use very small jars in your experiments?
As for the acidity of virginias, spraying anything on the tobacco isn't a good idea at all, in my view. You may want to try changing your diet -- you should, in fact, see improvements over time changing that.
Posted 4 months ago # -
I find letting them dry a little before smoking takes some of the "steam" out of them. I smoke a lot of ps lnf and I always let a flake or two dry half an hour or so before folding and stuffing. Makes for a better smoke IMHO.
Posted 4 months ago # -
quote]I find letting them dry a little before smoking takes some of the "steam" out of them. [/quote]
Dottle, while what you say certainly helps with reducing "steam" and the resultant burns the hot steam can produce when smoking, Flyguy's issue is caused by a chemical reaction to the virginia; it is this physical chemical reaction that causes the bite, not heat from steam.
Posted 4 months ago # -
I think it is a myth that Virginia, with its high(er) sugar content bites. Rather, it is Burley, with its greater alkalinity that is responsible for bite. Virginias can be sharp and piquant, and burn hot and scorch the tongue; but they do not bite, and no amount of aging will compensate for poor smoking habits.
I find myself sitting idly on the line dividing past and future,
as if I could kill time without injuring eternity. -- Thoreau
.Posted 4 months ago # -
cortezattic,
Burleys don't bother me a bit, only pure virginias and VaPers. I can dry them out to dust and smoke as slow as a tortoise and they still bite me. Virginias are acidic and burleys are more to the alkali side. Some people are apparently impervious to the virginia bite. Unfortunately, I am not and must take protective measures. I smoked a burley/virginia mix (MacBaren Navy Flake) all day yesterday with no bite whatsoever.Posted 4 months ago # -
Have you thought about stoving a tin? I only mention it since you brought up experimenting.
Hmm based on Mr. Pease it doesn't seem that it would help it mellow the sharpness of the Virginia's. Dunno.
pipesmagazine.com/blog/ask-g-l-pease/ask-g-l-pease-september-2011/]
On a side note I can't smoke a lblend with a lot of burley in it. The roof of my mouth and back of my throat start hurting immmediately.
Posted 4 months ago # -
@jah76: I think your post is proof that different smokers are affected by differing PHs. The acidic bothers me and the alkaline bothers you. Some smokers are blessed with cast iron mouths that can handle anything. I have tried heating up my virginias by placing it on a hot plate to dry it and could not tell that it raised the PH. I will try different things and if I stumble onto something that works, I will let you guys know.
Posted 4 months ago # -
I stand corrected,,I just didnt see were he mentioned anything about a chemical reaction, but sounded to me like he was suffering from some toung burn-bite, as I do, so for me, drying first helps alot with Virginia flakes.
Posted 4 months ago # -
flyguy:
I don't know if this will help or not, but I recently was able to smoke a 16+-year-old tin of Deerstalker, a straight VA that I'd first smoked back in the mid-1980s. I expected all kinds of deeper, richer flavors and enhanced sweetness. Instead, it smoked almost exactly as I noted when I first tried it. Maybe there was some softening/mellowing. . . but if it was there it was awfully subtle.
The experience left me hoping I live long enough to see some actual development among the VAs I've been cellaring!
Bob
Posted 4 months ago # -
flyguy, have you smoke a va flake with no red virginia's in it, like Dunhill flake?
HarrisPosted 4 months ago # -
rmbittner:
Did the tin still have that acidic smell (vinegar/catsup)? I have been told that a good Virginia has that smell as it ages/ferments. This smell is really noticeable in McClelland Virginias. Since vinegar is acidic, it is easy to draw the connection.Posted 4 months ago # -
flyguy:
You know, I've heard about this "ketchup" smell for years -- particularly with reference to McClelland blends -- and I have to say it's never been anything that I've ever noticed. Or maybe I've just been exposed to Virginias for so long -- I've been smoking a pipe since 1980 -- that I've always simply associated that aroma with aging tobacco rather than ketchup.
But to get more to the heart of your question: If anything, the aroma had only gotten richer over time. It had a marvelous, deep hay smell that I love.
Bob
Posted 4 months ago # -
Great! Then there is hope in aging my McClelland Virginias. I notice that SG virginias (BB and FVF) and Dunhill Flake do not have the vinegary smell. Maybe I should smoke those more and see if the bite is less.
Posted 4 months ago # -
Flyguy, Harris' point regarding red virginias is something you might consider, i.e., avoiding blends that contain red virginias, as doing so has worked very well for him and he smokes almost nothing but virginia flakes. Worth a shot
Posted 4 months ago # -
Harris and Roth:
I will give the sans red virginia flakes a shot. Thanks for the tips everyone!Posted 4 months ago # -
Flyguy, you know, it's possible that that "ketchup" scent --so often attributed to McClelland blends -- is a result of the specific Virginias and aging processes that are unique to that company. In my experience a number of British and European companies rely on African Virginias rather than American varieties, and their overall profile tends to be darker and, at least to me, deeper. Couple that with different approaches to aging, and it's not too surprising that their tin aromas would be quite different from McClelland's.
Bob
Posted 4 months ago # -
I have one more question: Which brands of Virginia Flakes and VaPers are without red virginia tobacco? Most of the descriptions just say "Virginias". I currently have a few tins of SG BBF, SG FVF, McBaren Navy Flake and Dunhill Flake.
(Note: I see from a previous post that Dunhill Flake has no red virginia tobacco- any others?)Posted 4 months ago # -
flyguy, careful of the Mac Baren Navy Flake, that one tingles me a bit. The SG flakes you have are no bite to my senses.
This is my list of no bite flakes that I have in my cellar. I detect no Red Virginia's in any of them and I am very sensitive to the stuff.
Virginia Flakes:
Fribourg&Treyer Cut Virginia Plug
Fribourg andd Treyer Vintage
Wessex Campaign Brigade Dark Flake
Wessex Brown Virginia Flake TR
Wessex Gold Virginia Flake TR
Wessex Gold Brick
Samuel Gawith Best Brown Flake
Samuel Gawith full Virginia Flake
Hamborger Veermaster
Dunhill Flake TR
Astley’s no. 44 Dark Flake TR
Solani Silver Flake TR
John Aylesbury Luxury Flake TR
Mac Baren HH Old Dark Fired
Esoterica Stonehaven
Rotary Navy Cut
Petersons Irish FlakeVirginia/Perique Flakes
Escudo
Solani 633 TR
Samuel Gawith St James Flake
Dunhill Deluxe Navy RollsPosted 4 months ago # -
Thanks cigrmaster,
I will keep this list for referral. Funny how people are different as I am unaffected by MacBaren Navy Flake. If I had a choice, I would smoke the McClelland Flakes all day as I love the flavor but will need to reduce them to an occasional smoke.
Posted 4 months ago # -
Flyguy, please let us know how "swearing off" the red virginia works out for you.
Posted 4 months ago # -
Roth,
Right now I am smoking Dunhill Flake in my trusty calabash. I am getting some bite but a lot less than the McClelland blends. It is not quite as sweet or tasty as the McClelland though.
Thanks guys for all your help!Posted 4 months ago #
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