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Advice on tobaccos that don't need to age

(36 posts)
  • Started 2 years ago by exterminatewho
  • Latest reply from oldgeezersmoker
  1. exterminatewho

    exterminatewho

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    Hello everyone, as the title suggests, I'm looking for tobacco that tastes great straight out of the tin or pouch (bulk). Right now, I'm enjoying a lot of tobacco, and I wonder how much better they'll be after aging. I plan on buying some blends that I love right now and jarring them for a year or more, but what should I be smoking right now while I wait for the aging process? Any blends that are known to be great right from the start? Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  2. mayfair70

    mayfair70

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    Who- From what I understand, most tobacco doesn't need to age, it just improves with age. That said, Virginias seem to benefit most from aging. Dark Fired Kentucky does as well in my experience. Others, such as Perique and Latakia, come down to personal taste and they have a definite shelf life around ten years, give or take a few years in either direction. Burley blends are the safest bet and don't change radically even after many years. So, Burley blends will change the least, and be very good with no aging, depending on what they are blended with.

    Long story short- All blends can be smoked right away. Some you will WANT to age to get the most out of the tobacco. I'm sure more experienced members will chime in and offer their expertise. Good luck!

    BTW, BIG Doctor Who fan here!

    The secret of life is honesty and fair dealing. If you can fake that, you’ve got it made. -Groucho Marx
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    Posted 2 years ago #
  3. anthonyrosenthal74

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    There are countless blends that are just fine fresh from the tin. Balkan blends such as Balkan Blue, or Black House, english blends, many virginias great for aging are also great fresh out of the tin, McClelland Navy Cavendish or Dark Star. Any aromatic, as aging doesn't do much for most of those. I'm currently in love with Kramer's Blend for Cary Grant, awesome fresh. Cornell & Diehl's Black Frigate is another. I'm going to say just about anything should be just fine fresh. Aging is just going to make it better. Especially virginias.

    Arrrrr, shiver me timbers! International Talk Like a Pirate Day is September the 19th!!!
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    Posted 2 years ago #
  4. didimauw

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    Carter Hall doesn't need to age. Delicious at any age.

    "I don't know half of you half as well as I should like, and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve."
    Posted 2 years ago #
  5. exterminatewho

    exterminatewho

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    Nice, that's actually quite awesome, since I was enjoying most of the tobacco I bought straight from the pouch and tin. I think I'll buy some luxury bullseye flake and age that for a couple of years and try it. I'm thinking of doing that with some Frog Mortons Cellar as well (I love FMC and Frog morton).

    BTW, I'm a HUGE Doctor Who fan as well (obviously), but I need to catch up on this latest season. I haven't had the time due to meeting deadlines (writer for BengalsWire.com) and getting through my last few weeks of school (I'm 27 and still going...I know).

    Posted 2 years ago #
  6. mso489

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    Most tobacco comes "fresh" aged a certain amount. So it's tobacco that comes aged as much as it needs to be you're probably seeking. Most aromatics come as good as they get and only lose flavor after that, although sometimes they taste better for that, or the Virginia in them improves as the flavoring fades. Most Latakia blends are quite good, and the Lat is as good as it gets right out of the freshly opened tin. Burley, if jarred, will be stable for a long time, won't improve or fade, so burleys are dependable if you like those.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  7. jpmcwjr

    jpmcwjr

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    Most Latakia blends are quite good, and the Lat is as good as it gets right out of the freshly opened tin.

    Ima hafta disagree which youse on dat, Tom.

    I know that you believe you understood what you think I said, but I'm not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant.
    Posted 2 years ago #
  8. beefeater33

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    Ima hafta disagree which youse on dat, Tom.
    Ebonics?..............

    "We are the music makers, and we are the dreamers of the dream..."
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    Posted 2 years ago #
  9. tschiraldi

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    Sounds more New Jersey Italian to me. If you like it enough to age it, you like it enough to smoke it now.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  10. toobfreak

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    Aromatics. They are what they are when you get them. No real advantage in aging them. Whatever they are topped with to get the flavor and aroma they have, aging for them is more like a deterioration. Usually, that deterioration is a slow fading of the quality, in some few cases, if it wasn't particularly good to begin with, the deterioration might be sort of a good thing.

    To Master Po: Is it not being able to see that makes you tire of life?
    Master Po: No! It is being able to hear!
    Posted 2 years ago #
  11. pipestud

    pipestud

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    [quote]Who- From what I understand, most tobacco doesn't need to age, it just improves with age. - mayfair70"

    Plus 1 on what mayfair said. It would not be smart of blenders to sell tobacco that wasn't good to go from the moment the tin or pouch is opened. And, some blends are as good as they are going to get with no aging. Others will improve greatly with age. But again, your tobacco should be good to go from the start.

    Pipestud
    Posted 2 years ago #
  12. clickklick

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    Some are better after they mellow from aging a bit. Takes a bit of sharpness off, but those needing the sharpness lessened are few and far between.

    Hobbyist Pipemaker - Carmette Pipes
    Posted 2 years ago #
  13. hawky454

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    In my opinion, most every blend is packaged ready to smoke and putting them away and waiting on them to get better is just going to result in disappointment.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  14. jpmcwjr

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    Sounds more New Jersey Italian to me. If you like it enough to age it, you like it enough to smoke it now.

    Right on both counts!

    You can't make a silk purse....etc..... But you can mitigate what you don't like through aging, sometimes.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  15. jpmcwjr

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    In my opinion, most every blend is packaged ready to smoke and putting them away and waiting on them to get better is just going to result in disappointment.

    Smiley? This notion is somewhat unique here!

    Is that your experience?

    Posted 2 years ago #
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    oldgeezersmoker

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    Arango/Stokebye Balkan Supreme is good to go fresh, have no intention of letting any age. The McClellands​ tinned Virginia's are good now, will definitely improve with age. Their 2015 can be a tad sharp to my taste, depending on how long it has been in stock, but just a few months takes care of that.

    Posted 2 years ago #
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    oldgeezersmoker

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    The Gospel according to John Loring, from his 1999 article,Dating English Tinned Tobacco,

    "I suspect that the aging of tobaccos treated with chemical additives and/or preservatives is effected in two ways. First, preservatives will retard the aging process. Second, the chemicals and the tobaccos will neither uniformly age nor maintain the original balance of flavors. Personal experiences leads me to believe that for at least the first decade the chemical component becomes more noticeable as the years go by. For these reasons I generally avoid 'cellering' of chemically treated or preserved tobaccos and tend to believe the manufacturers of those blends when they state that their blends are best smoked shortly after purchase."

    Amen.

    My experience is in accordance.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  18. calabashed

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    I actually think the perique in some VaPers looses some subtle flavors with time and air exposure, though on the flip side the Virginias improve and the flavors meld together better. I love Mac Baren's HH Acadian Perique with at least a couple years on it, but I also like it enough fresh that when I was stocking up I also stashed 1 pound in a large mason jar and vacuum sealed it as hard as possible with a Foodsaver attachment, which is to say about 10% atmospheric pressure. Should be able to open that one decades from now and still experience something very like what it was fresh. Sometimes I think this would be a good idea for folks to do with a lot of current blends, what with the uncertainty of production and regulation these days. Kind of like tobacco time capsules so future blenders would be able to recreate blends that have fallen out of production closer to what they were like at the time.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  19. curl

    curl

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    Question about this post....

    The Gospel according to John Loring, from his 1999 article,Dating English Tinned Tobacco,

    "I suspect that the aging of tobaccos treated with chemical additives and/or preservatives is effected in two ways. First, preservatives will retard the aging process. Second, the chemicals and the tobaccos will neither uniformly age nor maintain the original balance of flavors. Personal experiences leads me to believe that for at least the first decade the chemical component becomes more noticeable as the years go by. For these reasons I generally avoid 'cellering' of chemically treated or preserved tobaccos and tend to believe the manufacturers of those blends when they state that their blends are best smoked shortly after purchase."

    Amen.

    My experience is in accordance.

    ...did Mr Loring specify any blends when he talked about additives and preservatives? Or can anyone else here name names?

    Posted 2 years ago #
  20. jmatt

    jmatt

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    At least one manufacturer gets annoyed at smokers faffing with his tobacco.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  21. toobfreak

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    Aromatics. I am betting that if you look at most of the blends that they say smoke right away and don't age or people have had bad aging experience with, I bet most of them are aromatics. Then there are those whom the company TELLS you to age them for best flavor, such as Joie de Vivre, Chenet Cake and others. In fact, they tell you to let them stoke for up to ten years.

    Let's not mention those who bake their tobacco for false aging on their dashboard or in the oven. Not all blends take to aging, but those that do give a differing result from when it was new and many like that difference. Not anyone's place to lay a blanket statement that aging doesn't work in ALL circumstances!

    Posted 2 years ago #
  22. hawky454

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    Smiley? This notion is somewhat unique here!

    Is that your experience?

    Yes, for the most part. I find that blends I waited on for 5-10 years are usually no better than they were fresh out of the tin and more often than not, I prefer the fresh tin over the aged tin. There have been exceptions though, my 5 year old Stonehaven is pretty damn good with age on it but it's not good enough that I would put off smoking a fresh tin for 5 years just so I can have it aged. I think that changes take place with cellared baccy but I think those changes are highly overrated. I just recently smoked some Escudo from 99 and while it was pretty good, I still enjoy a fresh tin just as much, if not more. Obviously this is all subjective I'm just reporting my take on the subject. It's near impossible to avoid aging tobacco as my cellar has grown to be very large over the years but I cellar more because I'm worried about the future of the business than I am to actually age blends. I continue to experiment and have fun with it though.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  23. crashthegrey

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    It's interesting to see so many that don't believe in the aging hype. I personally like an aged Virginia, but hesitate to wait that long. When I can get an aged tin at the same price, I jump on it. But it's good to know that aging isn't as universally regarded as I thought.

    Posted 2 years ago #
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    oldgeezersmoker

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    @curl, you can read John's article and see for yourself.

    Link to John Loring article

    I knew John well from pipe shows and trades of both tobacco and pipes for a period of over 15 years. He was one of several people that got me interested in aged tobacco from about 1982 on. He is deceased as you may know and I would not in any way presume to speak for him beyond what he has written. He did not, nor do I, believe that just because a tobacco might not improve with age meant that it is without merit, which he states in one of his writings.

    Posted 2 years ago #
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    oldgeezersmoker

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    @hawky454, the last Cope's Escudo made by Gallahers in the UK was in 1994. Your experience with a 1999 tin made on the European continent is not surprising to me.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  26. mso489

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    Three words: Captain Black Grape.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  27. crashthegrey

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    mso couldn't be more correct. Needs no aging at all. Lol.

    Posted 2 years ago #
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    oldgeezersmoker

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    @mso489, two words

    Five Brothers

    Posted 2 years ago #
  29. toobfreak

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    I believe the efficacy of aging largely depends on the freedom from heavy chemicals and the amount of virginia in a blend. Other tobaccos respond differently and Latakia and Perique soften with age. Sometimes that is a good thing.

    But aging is largely incidental in today's world--- if you are to cushion insurance to escape the throws of the FDA in eliminating favorite brands and availability then you probably have to cellar. And with cellaring comes aging. Rather a moot point whether it improves it or not, you will find out when you open it; but having it aged good or bad is a lot better thing than not having it at all.

    Posted 2 years ago #
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    oldgeezersmoker

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    @toobfreak, +1

    Add in the possibility of internet sales restrictions as with RYO, tax increases and costs of compliance with FDA rules that will be passed on and marked up at every stage of the distribution process.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  31. mso489

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    Five Brothers ... now that's a fact!

    Posted 2 years ago #
  32. toobfreak

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    As an aside to the aging issue, I got an email the other day from P&C mentioning the Pennsylvania Sales Tax on tobacco being 55¢ an ounce and their decision to eat that cost rather than pass it on to the consumer. Not really relevant to the topic here but I don't feel like starting a whole new thread about P&C.

    Posted 2 years ago #
  33. iamn8

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    All tobacco haveto age. There are some laws of the universe which can't be broken.

    Nate @ Moody AL
    Posted 2 years ago #
  34. deathmetal

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    Nate has a point (as usual).

    If you want the A++ experience, age your tobacco.

    If you are like me and just want to smoke, pick anything that sounds good and enjoy the heck out of it.

    "My own experience has been that the tools I need for my trade are paper, tobacco, food, and a little whiskey." -- William Faulkner

    The Metal Mixtures
    Posted 2 years ago #
  35. huntertrw

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    "Five Brothers ... now that's a fact!"

    True, true, true. It is vile when packaged, and aging won't help it one bit!

    Love Me, Love My Pipe
    Posted 2 years ago #
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    oldgeezersmoker

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    @huntertrw, true, but aging doesn't hurt it either.

    Posted 2 years ago #

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