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About My Operating System

(44 posts)
  1. mso489

    mso489

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    I'm on an old MacOS, Snow Leopard from early 2009, so updates are long gone, and service is failing. I lost email yesterday. I'll try to wangle it back into service, but so far no luck. My point is, if I drop out of sight, I'll be working on getting an updated device and hope to reappear in the not distant future. To its credit, Pipesmagazine is a reliable friend so far, perhaps because their programming is vintage, so will still sync in with mine. Likewise, Pipesandcigars still works too. So much gratitude to both. None of the other retailers will open. "Safari Can't Connect" etc. It's a comfort while it lasts, since I can't even email family right now. Just a heads up, since members disappearing has caused some alarm in the past. I'm still here, and if I go silent, I'll be working to get back! A 2009 OS is like from the Pleistocene. It ain't like an old rotary phone you can plug in the wall and still use.

    Posted 2 months ago #
  2. jpmcwjr

    jpmcwjr

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    In the meantime, Tom, why not try Firefox and Chrome for Mac? Yes, ten years old for any O/S is a bit long in the tooth. I've been very happy with my MacBook Pro, from 2013, but one day.....

    I know that you believe you understood what you think I said, but I'm not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant.
    Posted 2 months ago #
  3. olkofri

    Olkofri

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    Neither FF nor Chrome will work with old versions of MacOS. Getting ahold of older versions that do work is a major hassle, and after going through the installing ordeal they might still not work or have lots of things broken in pages.

    Sometimes you have no choice but to upgrade.

    Not the sweet, new grass with flowers is this harvesting of mine;
    Not the upland clover bloom...
    Posted 2 months ago #
  4. mso489

    mso489

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    Today I can't get pipesandcigars either from Forums or just by Googling, so I'm another step behind the eight ball. I think an upgrade is imminent. But I'll hang around here as long as I can still open pipesmagazine. I think minor updates on various sites close me out one site at a time. It's the cost of improvements in newer gear, such as they are. I remember when refrigerators commonly lasted forty years, said the grumpy old man. Sad that this desktop has a big, bright screen, and other good attributes. I think an interim update with the last op system that installs on this hardware would soon go through the same decline. Despite myself, I'm pretty attached to online doings. Then there will be a learning curve, which is steep for my contrary non-techie mind. The computer science logic grid and I are in different universes. If I lapse on posts, figure the Apple Store or Best Buys is soon to rack up a tidy profit.

    Posted 2 months ago #
  5. mso489

    mso489

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    What the optimal useable lifespan for a stadard device, like a desk top or a laptop? That might be useful in calculating how much I do or do not want to invest in the next one. I think at ten years, this desk top was about $150 per year, maybe more.

    Posted 2 months ago #
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    jojoc

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    changing to Chrome or Firefox is unlikely to fix this. The issue is that almost all web sites are or will be changing to https from http. The old OS simply has no way to establish the secure connection required. I just fired up my old MacBookPro from 08. It could not connect to any of the web pages I attempted - error of "no common encryption algorithms". Mine is running OS X 10.5 Leopard. I have no idea how many versions of OS you would have to move forward to to make this work, but the newer OS would likey slow the machine down substantially.

    Really, in today's world, I figure 3-6 years max for device functional life. 3 years if you want to retain full function. You can push it out past that to 6 or so years if you are willing to take the risks of operating with decreased security due to programs that are beyond the end of support life.

    Posted 2 months ago #
  7. shanez

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    When you upgrade you'll find more options than you care to know about, but, if I were buying something today to replace what I have it would most likely be this:

    ASUS VivoBook

    Or one very similar.

    My wife has a very nice macbook thingy but I can't see the point of spending 4x the $ for what she got over this. That and I can't stand crapple products. I'm not a fan of winblows either and usually load Linux on my stuff but it can be tricky sometimes.

    Posted 2 months ago #
  8. swilford

    swilford

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    Just to chime in quickly, there are really good reasons you are struggling to visit websites. Since I know that not being able to access Smokingpipes is a frustration for you that you've mentioned in the past, I thought a thorough explanation might help:

    A lot of the reason that websites are becoming inaccessible is that PCI accreditation is predicated on certain cryptographic protocols being used (specifically, SSL 3.0 and TLS 1.0 were deprecated in 2018). Compatibility with older browsers is something that website developers think about, but we can push it only so far if we want to be able to pass information securely, which is really important, particularly for things like e-commerce, banking or anywhere else financial data is handled.

    The reason that you've continued to be able to access pipesmagazine.com is that the whole site is unencrypted. Frankly, in my opinion, that's not a problem. There's no data passed here that is sensitive. However, Google (et al) have been pushing towards encrypting all http traffic and punishing sites (through search rankings in Google's case) that don't encrypt by default, so this has changed in the past few years even for websites where no sensitive information is handled.

    I don't know how pipesandcigars.com continued to be accessible to you and retain the Level 3 or Level 4 PCI compliance designation that they surely must have (I'm sure they resolved it somehow; I just don't know how). I'm surprised it worked for you as long as it did.

    Sykes

    Posted 2 months ago #
  9. pappymac

    pappymac

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    MSO - Don't listen to the Machaters out there, the big problem I have with windows or android devices is that there are still more viruses and worms written for them then there are for Mac OS.

    Just two months ago I traded in my late-2011 Macbook Pro because it was getting too slow in loading the latest OSX on start-up. It still worked, but the newer software is more memory intensive also. My current desktop is a late-2013 iMac and it is still performing great even running OSX 10.14.5.

    I have been a Mac user since 1986 and I have never experienced a problem from viruses, worms. My system has never been hacked into either. Since I use my computers to make money, this is a bonus for me. I change them out ever 8 years on average.

    My oldest son, uses windows based computers. He averages a new computer once ever 2 years or so.

    I am glad we have a good admin and responsible moderators.

    Heave to you dark colored ship under sail! Prepare to be boarded!
    Posted 2 months ago #
  10. mso489

    mso489

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    swil', that gives me a clearer concept of what's happening. Thanks. Pappy, I'll probably go with Mac again. I had aversion therapy with PC and windows when I set up a computer at home, belatedly. It sure helps to have some innate interest in this technology. I've tried, but it just doesn't happen for me. I struggle, all uphill, but other than my narrow little lane of usage, it's not satisfying. Remember word processing, desktop publishing ... what magic it was going to be. I do look forward to accessing web sites in the usual way.

    Posted 2 months ago #
  11. skydog

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    I won't share my feelings on apple products if that's what you're used to and what you're planning on going with. To each their own.

    My current setup is a 2014 windows laptop plugged into the big screen TV with a wireless keyboard mouse combo so I can sit on the recliner and stream Netflix and browse the forums. Maybe you could look into a different type of setup to save a little cash? Best of luck!

    Posted 2 months ago #
  12. mso489

    mso489

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    skydog, sounds kind of cool, putting together your own array of gear. I won't tell my long, sad story of work place and then home frustrations with computers. Suffice it to say I started at work with a DECmate PC/word processor, proceeded to IBM/Word set-up, and things went downhill from there. When I set up at home, Dell eventually sent me a check from a big lawsuit. My ten years on a Mac hasn't been a world of fun, but until the last year, has worked. Since I have no talent for computers, I have to go with whatever seems to function in my presence. Lately I've followed various online instructions on how to re-enter my email, and I have phone numbers to the purpose, but the investment of time almost never rewards the efforts. It's pretty pleasing when some fix actually works, but for me, that's like every three years. Good for folks who can get into the game and get useful results.

    Posted 2 months ago #
  13. mso489

    mso489

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    Off to the Apple Store and Best Buys, soon if not today. The local Apple Store gets rather middling marks on Yelp -- too crowded, high staff turnover, I'd say from my visits. Used to be better, and my first Mac was bought on a state tax-free day in August, since suspended by the legislature. So I'll nose around and price around before taking the plunge. I think Apple might do a better set-up than Best Buy, if I got the right person. Though the last crew left the AOL account on the current desktop, and it has about 5K emails, and I'll never use it again. I should have been asked, and the account cancelled. I need about a third of the documents off my current device. Much is outdated from when my wife was sharing before she got set up. I need to rescue manuscripts, lots of man hours. Maybe all this should be easier, but I no play'a the game, I no make'a the rules.

    Posted 2 months ago #
  14. bnichols23

    Bill Nichols

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    heads up, since members disappearing

    Noted, with a bit of a bummed, Tom. Hope you get a more reliable setup soon.

    It's not my standard to flay an OS contra to mine unless I'm just being an imp, or if the user really is suffering, so worry not -- no Redmond or Linux or Unix or koha evangelism coming your way. I'm more concerned about your connectivity & continued well-being here. Your absence would be keenly felt. Serious.

    B

    Head Black Frigate keelhauler, boss powder monkey, & troublemaker 1st class.
    Posted 2 months ago #
  15. sablebrush52

    sablebrush52

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    My home gear is about the same vintage, though I updated to Lion last year. Had my machine been manufactured a mere 4 months later, I could have upgraded the OS to Yosemite and beyond. In any event, the handwriting is on the wall and certain sites will not allow me to handle transactions for security reasons. For now I can use my work computer to handle this or my cell, which I frankly do not trust to be secure.

    I've used both Mac and PC and prefer Mac, especially for how I use it. Color works better on a Mac. Partisans are welcome to their personal delusions. I've been holding out for a new pro level Mac and from what I'm reading there should finally be a new one this year. Now, if Apple doesn't screw this up, I'll be set for years to come.

    It is better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to open one's mouth and remove all doubt. - Mark Twain

    It is pointless to argue with a fanatic since a dim bulb can't be converted into a searchlight. - Jesse Silver
    Posted 2 months ago #
  16. mso489

    mso489

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    The problem with older updates, for me anyway, is that it takes a lot of work to get them functioning and then they begin to decline, so there's a lot of time lost with this transition and the next. sable', a new pro level Mac would keep things good or some years ahead. Even my gear was rigorous with updates for four or five years, then Apple just quit on it, and I'm on my own. I have a thumb drive update to a more recent, but still outdated OS, and it may just not be worth the trouble. With my skills and attitude. I try to be upbeat and dive into fixes, but mostly it's lost time. Desk tops are just enough out of fashion that it might be possible to get something new, albeit with a smaller screen, for a possible if not affordable price. I've been twiddling with email and trying to reset my IMAP, etc. I have what the U.S. automakers used to be accused of, planned obsolescence. Then all this plastic, circuitry, chips, and rare metals go into the waste stream. In the long view, not a good plan.

    Posted 2 months ago #
  17. folanator

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    Posted 2 months ago #
  18. mso489

    mso489

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    Thanks for the considered opinions and moral support. With email out, and most web sites blocked, I feel like one of those polar bears on the melting ice flows, though out of respect for them, I will admit, I'm eating well. Funny how the operating system gives up ground a little at at time. I've wangled my way to email first from a ready access, then to a two-step process, then to a three-step process, and so forth. It convincingly let me know that despite the handsome large screen and fond memories of the good old days with this desk top, this is definitely coming to an end. Wouldn't it be cool if Apple devised a way to update the hardware, which they could no doubt do. But why would they? Another sucker, uh customer, in the door. I can't go back to Microsoft with an even more traumatic experience. It was like this new. I was sold email and it wasn't there! I spent hours on the help line, and in retrospect, the customer service was just playing with hapless buyers. It was quite a scam. A retired IBM employee came to help me, and after twiddling a month, I was online in fifteen minutes. Not going back to that. At least I didn't waste much of my friend's time; he threw in a disc and voila, email.

    Posted 2 months ago #
  19. taildraggin

    taildraggin

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    They were having sales on 21" iMacs last week. Quite a nice machine.

    Posted 2 months ago #
  20. mso489

    mso489

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    'draggin, that's the one we were looking at online, on my wife's iPad which still has some function. I'll probably buy in-store to get first-hand help on set-up, maybe dragging the current desk-top in there. I'm spoiled with the bigger screen, but I think 21" would do just fine. Lots of different versions. So many functions I don't need, wouldn't use, but a few I need some extra power.

    Posted 2 months ago #
  21. jpmcwjr

    jpmcwjr

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    Tom-

    Almost certainly your new Mac will have much more storage than the machine that's being replaced, so no need to erase (delete) anything.

    If you get it at the Apple store, they should set it up completely for you. I've been upgrading for so long, I just use Migration Assistant, piece of cake. Since my current Mac has been in service for six years and is up to date O/S wise, you may have a long time with a new one.

    If you have a current Time Machine® backup, just take that into the store. Otherwise, the setup will require you taking your old machine in.

    Posted 2 months ago #
  22. mikethompson

    mikethompson

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    Thanks for the heads up Tom, don't you go slipping through the cracks!

    I'm a big fan of 'if its not broken don't fix it', but when you stop being able to access things, you gotta do it.

    Posted 2 months ago #
  23. taildraggin

    taildraggin

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    Tom, see if you can back your stuff up from the old machine to iCloud. It will automatically config the new machine. Good luck! -Charlie

    Posted 2 months ago #
  24. hawky454

    hawky454

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    I’ve got the latest Mac Book Pro, it’s a total super computer and worth every cent. It makes me wonder how I stuck with PC’s for so long.

    Posted 2 months ago #
  25. mikethompson

    mikethompson

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    If we lose Tom in the Redesign it just may be too much for me to take!

    Posted 2 months ago #
  26. mso489

    mso489

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    Thanks for help and encouragement. I'll hang on here if possible, until I get a current device.

    Posted 2 months ago #
  27. sablebrush52

    sablebrush52

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    Wouldn't it be cool if Apple devised a way to update the hardware, which they could no doubt do. But why would they?

    Actually, that's what is promised in this latest Mac Pro release. The idea is that a pro user can reconfigure hardware architecture with greater ease and flexibility and Apple will have a new market they can supply.

    I'm surprised that you can't get your email. My gear is older than yours and so far no problems with my email. I use my browser. I stopped using a dedicated email app years ago for a variety of reasons.

    Posted 2 months ago #
  28. mso489

    mso489

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    sable', this is through my browser. First I could override the non-connection by simply clicking continue; I think there was another two step process; and lately I have had to go through a "forwarding mail" step that worked. But now I come up against the wall I receive for web sites, "cannot establish a secure connection," which I suppose is the newer programming failing to connect with my older hardware. I'll call my wi-fi provider and see what temporary fixes might be done, and also how to get an email address with a new device that isn't a holdover from a passe wi-fi provider. The Mac Pro update availability is an excellent idea. I doubt I'll want to pay the price, but I'd like to do it. If they make good on the promise, it would be excellent. Updating hardware is an expense but also a set-back for a learning curve.

    Posted 2 months ago #
  29. elessar

    elessar

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    I too have a very old Macbook and feel your pain when things become obsolete. My work requires me to use some software that does not work on a Apple OS environment so I moved over to Windows years ago. I always liked Mac better, until I started building my own desktop computers running Windows 10. All of my systems have been rock solid and very fast. I am starting to be a believer in the newer Windows OS, but I have only limited experience with purchased machines ie. Dell.

    Posted 2 months ago #
  30. mso489

    mso489

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    I do admire your building your own system, elessar. It gives you a more complete sense of how things work and what's going on. My ineptitude is partly coming to the digital world relatively late, though I know some people who came to computers in their sixties and later who are fire-breathing digital operators. I don't really know, but I suspect, if I'd come to it as a kid or teenager, I would have reveled in it, the way I did things photographic and to some degree with radios. I think people who are starting as kids, and who consider a lot of their time on devices as play, have a much better sense of the logic, and especially the quirks, of the digital "mind." To me it's all frustration and insult except when everything is going as expected. To those steeped in the culture, it's more like a rollicking sport. Doesn't work? Watch this!

    Posted 2 months ago #
  31. puffy

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    I think that part of what were good at depends on the culture we were brought up in.I can grow a beautiful garden.My grandmother taught me as a kid.She lived on a farm..I'm almost 77 years old and I can barely operate a 5 year old smart phone..I know nothing of what's being discussed in this thread.I don't know how folks learn all this stuff.Everything these days is so high tech I've got numbers coming out of my ears.Lucky for me I've got my son to guide me through this numbers crazed world..I hope you get set up with what you need..You're a valuable part of this forum'

    Life's most valuable treasure is..Love
    Posted 2 months ago #
  32. jpmcwjr

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    I just hit my 3/4 C mark, and revel in all stuff electronic.

    Tom, see if you can back your stuff up from the old machine to iCloud. It will automatically config the new machine. Good luck! -Charlie

    I would advise against this, unless one has been using iCloud all along. Much better to have the Apple Store staff to the migration and set up on site.

    Posted 2 months ago #
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    redone

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    MSO - hope I’m not too late to chime in but you might be just fine with a new iPad Pro. I do most all of my work and web browsing on a new one. With the smart key board, pencil, and with my office using Office 365, I can do 99% of what I need to do on the iPad Pro. My older Mac Book Pro is still working fine for basic home functions but it may soon be in the position yours is in.

    Posted 2 months ago #
  34. hawky454

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    ^ You’re right, if all you are using the computer for is searching the web and checking emails there are much cheaper options than getting a Mac or some other high tech machine.

    Posted 2 months ago #
  35. cachimbero

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    You can always plug the Ipad pro to a screen, and, after September you are going to be able to use a mouse and have real file management. My Ipad pro has changed the way I work and now I don´t have to carry around a laptop. I feel very reluctant to give up my home desktop, but, if IpadOS (expected in September) delivers as I hope, the 27 inch 7 years old Imac I am typing this on may well be my last PC.

    Posted 2 months ago #
  36. cossackjack

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    +1 for iPadPro.
    I also have a 2018 MacBook Pro 13” as my main computer, but use the iPadPro when mobile. I’m looking forward to iPad iOS 13 in September.

    "A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly.
    Specialization is for insects!" - Robert Heinlein
    Posted 2 months ago #
  37. jpmcwjr

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    Do you use an external keyboard with the iPadPro? If so, an Apple one or 3rd party?

    Posted 2 months ago #
  38. cachimbero

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    I take notes handwritten when in the go, with a wonderful app that converts into text if required (and indexes my hand written words), and use a regular bluetooth apple keyboard while at home with the iPad on an "atril" (don´t know the English word, a book stand like those used in churches). I used to have one of those Apple keyboard covers (which work really well) in my previous generation Ipad pro (10,5), but I have found it is not necessary (for my work/use anymore).

    Posted 2 months ago #
  39. mso489

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    If portability really isn't a thing with a user, it seems like you get what you need with a desktop, or am I going down the wrong road again? My wife and I have taken to dark humor about our fading presence on devices. I call Forums my last connection to the world, and my imaginary friend. I sure get more information and considered opinion on here than I do from the various devices and the computer "kids" who chat with or field phone calls from the less computered masses. Other than my silly geezer flip phone, I don't want to bring the digital world with me. It's nice to be able to get up and leave that whole wasps nest on the desk. In ancient days, when I wanted to use a telephone, I didn't have to take a course in being a telephone lineman, which is sort of the learning curve on our "little digital friends."

    Posted 2 months ago #
  40. taildraggin

    taildraggin

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    MSO, It's a bit dear, but you you will be delighted with the 21" IMac. The screen is very good and you don't need a "big one" for your purposes. It's one of the few products that ranges between both the deepest and most casual users. It's a quality piece.

    Beware the 'dates' - they are identified(and priced) by their release date. The latest is "Early 2019" and there are a lot of "Mid 2017" still on the market. (A new 2017 would be good for you, too, but you don't want to pay the price of the latest 2019 the still-sold-new 2017).

    See: https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/search?Ntt=apple%20imac%2021.5%22&N=0&InitialSearch=yes&sts=ps

    I've also bought Apple Refurbs and cannot distinguish them from new (aside from warranty). You can check here periodically - they come and go: https://www.apple.com/shop/refurbished/mac/21-5-inch-imac

    Cheers, - Charlie

    Posted 2 months ago #
  41. mso489

    mso489

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    taildraggin, thank you for the excellent update on Mac desktops. The 21" seems to be an obvious choice for me, just looking at them online on my wife's iPad. Knowing the detail about year models is helpful, in figuring out what I'm looking at and what I'd be paying for. I wouldn't mind a refurb. There may be a slight advantage in getting the most recent, or a recent version, to extend its life out further. I'm going to go to the Apple store for an initial reconnaissance mission, ask questions, price things, and review other options like laptops. I think Mac is trending toward extending operating system updates on its Mac pros, which is a good idea, but I'm too early for that one on the less exalted models. I have sure learned a lot more from Forums than I have from the commercial sources, and have some basis for asking questions of the sales staff. We're going to my wife's medical appt today, and I have some other tasks at hand, but may make it to Apple Store, and maybe Best Buy for comparison, in the next day or two.

    Posted 2 months ago #
  42. jpmcwjr

    jpmcwjr

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    Good plan, Tom. I've had regular O/S updates on my MacBook Pro for the six years I've been using it. It's not any different from the other models in terms of the O/S; it has hardware that's a bit faster than the non-pro models.

    Posted 2 months ago #
  43. cossackjack

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    jpmcwjr:
    I have the Apple Smart Keyboard Folio for 12.9-inch iPad Pro (3rd Generation).
    Pros:
    Lightweight; slim profile
    Fair-to-good keyboard tactile response (not as good as the MacBook Pro)
    Folds completely back to use the iPad as a touch-screen tablet
    Cons:
    Expensive
    No backlighting - charcoal colored keys & gray key labels

    I would consider the Logitech Slim Folio Pro (for iPad Pro 11" & 12.9" [3rd Gen]) instead of the Apple folio keyboard.

    For a retired iPad Gen 3, I used a Zagg Bluetooth keyboard which had excellent key response, backlit keys with selectable backlighting colors & intensities, but was bulkier, & had a slot to hold the iPad - it was not a folio design. It can be used with my iPhone (as can any Bluetooth keyboards).

    Posted 2 months ago #
  44. jpmcwjr

    jpmcwjr

    Preferred Member
    Joined: May 2015
    Posts: 13,528

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    Thanks, jack. Good info.

    Posted 2 months ago #

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