Sasieni One Dot Fake

[dmcmtk]

I noticed this pipe last night after an auction for a genuine Sasieni pipe closed. I've said it before on this forum, NEVER buy a collectable Sasieni from Italy.

OLD SASIENI PIPE ONE DOT FAMILY ERA SPECIALLY SELECTED TOP CONDITIONS | eBay - https://www.ebay.com/itm/OLD-SASIENI-PIPE-ONE-DOT-FAMILY-ERA-SPECIALLY-SELECTED-TOP-CONDITIONS/173924584008?_trkparms=aid%3D111001%26algo%3DREC.SEED%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20160727114228%26meid%3Dfa024dffa83b42d8b094b101bae71d6b%26pid%3D100290%26rk%3D4%26rkt%3D4%26sd%3D352765015322%26itm%3D173924584008%26pmt%3D1%26noa%3D1%26pg%3D2060778&_trksid=p2060778.c100290.m3507

There is so much wrong about this pipe, it's Micky Mouse...spurious... not genuine, and it's worth...

 

[cshubhra]

How to spot a fake?

Since you mentioned that this is a fake, two things came to my mind (Without knowing much about Sasieni) - thickness of the bowl and the shape of the bit at the end of the stem.

In general though how to spot a fake Sasieni?

 

[ben88]

Wow... Seller has almost 800 feedbacks @ 100%

 

[burleyboy]

I‘m far away from being an expert on this, but slot and button look very un-sasieni-ish. Also the „Made in England“ stamp is in an oval shape on original ones, I think.

 

[cshubhra]

Good catch - my family Era Sasieni looks like this

I‘m far away from being an expert on this, but slot and button look very un-sasieni-ish. Also the „Made in England“ stamp is in an oval shape on original ones, I think.

EDIT - I have seen Early Sasieni (With Patent no) which looks like the fake one above

 

[sablebrush52]

Also the „Made in England“ stamp is in an oval shape on original ones, I think.

That's correct. It's also missing the "London Made" stamp under the Sasieni swash as near as I can tell. The shaping of the button looks way off, more like a molded stem than hand cut. The shaping of the bowl seems correct, and I'm not sure that the bowl is a fake, though it could be. Part of the problem is that every maker was a little inconsistent about their stamping.

Faking Sasieni stems happens occasionally, because the one and eight dot stems are more collectible. So replacing a 4 dot stem with an eight dot or one dot stem might earn you a cool 50¢. It's a nickel and dime level of chicanery and seems hardly worth the effort involved. Faking a Bo Nordh can net thousands.

 

[ssjones]

I'd say that tenon looks very un-Sasieni like.

 

[dmcmtk]

I'd say that tenon looks very un-Sasieni like.

That's an undestatement. Very noticeably drilled off center, and the airway diameter is much to small to accomadate a stinger. The SPECIALLY SELECTED marking is very crisp, but where is the S...? Mortise drilling looks off also. The early One Dots did have MADE IN ENGLAND markings, I've seen linear style, and also across the top of the shank. I've seen the LG mark before (Large) but wouldn't also expect a shape number. The button is way to tall, and bulky. The stem is not original. I don't think the stummel is genuine either.

 

[cshubhra]

Just to make sure I am learning....

This is from another Buy it now from eBay. I think this is a replacement stem - the dots (FOUR DOTS) are not symmetrical

 

[dmcmtk]

Just to make sure I am learning....

This is from another Buy it now from eBay. I think this is a replacement stem - the dots (FOUR DOTS) are not symmetrical

View attachment 2271

Believe it or not, there actually can be some variation. Is that pipe a FOUR DOT or a 4DOT? Hard to tell from the picture. I will say the button looks more correct than the pipe's in the OP.

 

[cshubhra]

Thats a FOUR DOT

Believe it or not, there actually can be some variation. Is that pipe a FOUR DOT or a 4DOT? Hard to tell from the picture. I will say the button looks more correct than the pipe's in the OP.

 

[sablebrush52]

Just to make sure I am learning....

This is from another Buy it now from eBay. I think this is a replacement stem - the dots (FOUR DOTS) are not symmetrical

View attachment 2271

Yeah, not symmetrical, but in the wrong direction. The asymmetry runs longitudinally along the length of the stem, not across the width, and it's only one dot that's a little farther from the other three, which are equidistant from each other. It's a clear replacement as is the stem in the OP post. On later Sasieni pipes, the dots were equidistant and at some point were enlarged.
With the "one dot" stem, the flow along the shank is not followed in the shaping of that stem.
Moreover, the length of the slot is waaaay too short with both of these pipes. Real Sasieni slots of the Pre-War period are much longer east-west.