Research Biologist Meets Tobacco Bloom

[mikestanley]

A very informative post and thread.
"My own additional thought: Think about how tobacco is packaged. Esoterica eight ounce bags are practically vacuum sealed with little to no air (oxygen) present. Their 2 ounce tins are packed full. Then think about tins with plenty of air space (McClelland, C&D, etc). It seems like that could be making a real difference, although my son thinks the oxygen gets depleted pretty quickly in any sealed tin."
It is my understanding that McClelland tins it's tobacco in a low oxygen environment. My experience with McClelland is that their tobaccos seem to age at a slower pace than other brands in similar tins do.
Mike S.

 

[jefff]

This is a great thread! Thank your son for me.

 

[jitterbugdude]

I'm leaning toward it being sugar. Here's why: I have Virginia Whole Leaf ( about 2 pounds) that I shredded about 4 years ago. It has been in sealed mason jars ever since. I have never seen any bloom in this stuff yet I have seen bloom in commercial pipe tobacco that contains Virginia. I suspect what we are seeing is the sugar that is added by the manufacturers as part of their casing. At some point it precipitates out due to yeast, bacteria or some other unknown entity.
I also have pounds and pounds of Turkish tobacco and although it is lower in naturals sugars than Virginias I've never seen bloom on it either.
I tend to count out indigenous enzymes or bacteria too because Virginias are heated to 165F and 185F (for Red). This temp would kill off those little critters. On the other hand, once the tobacco starts getting processed and handled it has plenty of opportunities to pick up microbes from the environment.

 

[lestrout]

Yo jit - you have some very good points there. I dimly recall Greg Pease and his UCal-Berkeley chem/biology friends doing some hi-tech (at the time) chemical analysis and finding some of the crystals weren't sugar but some other organic chemical with names too long for me to remember right now.
As far as the crystallized sugar being from the casings: wouldn't the taste of the smoke be just as sweet if the sugar were crystals as if it were still distributed throughout the tobacco?
hp

les

 

[pappymac]

Sugar? I'm still more interested in harvesting the yeast from tobacco leaves to brew beer. Think about it!

Beer brewed with Kentucky Burley. It could be named Tobacco Juice.

 

[foolwiththefez]

Pappymac, even more than just the yeast there may be some good bacteria for creating a Belgium-style sour beer. I'm seriously going to speak to my home brew guru over the weekend about culturing yeast. If we can figure out a way to get it done, I'll let you know.

 

[hawky454]

Good post, I really enjoyed it. A note: I never notice a degradation in taste from the moment I open the aged tin (jar) to months down the road. It all tastes the same to me and I'm okay with that. Maybe I don't have the sensitive pallet that everyone else seems to have but I try not to over think this and just enjoy what I have.

 

[sladeburns]

I love how the homebrewer's minds jump straight to "I could make beer with that!" To a homebrewer, a trip down an aisle in a supermarket is a mental exercise in beer recipe speculation. Hmm...baked bean bbq porter? Nah!
It would be interesting to find out if you could get some of those fun Belgian esters infused in a tobacco.

 

[jerwynn]

Awesomely totally utterly fascinating thread!! WOW!! Lovin' it!

 

[jitterbugdude]

as the crystallized sugar being from the casings: wouldn't the taste of the smoke be just as sweet if the sugar were crystals as if it were still distributed throughout the tobacco?

Les, Possible, but if you've ever mixed a solid (sugar)with a liquid and didn't mix it very well it will taste sweeter because you are tasting more of the solids (sugar).
It's a shame scientists didn't have the state of the art diagnostic equipment we have today back in the 30's, 40's 50's when some real tobacco research was being conducted. Even today it is still debated as to whether enzymes or bacteria are responsible for the "fermentation" of tobacco leaf.

 

[mayfair70]

Egyptians brewed beer and made bread with the same yeasts. Most ancient agricultural societies allowed ambient air to dry their crops in store houses. The yeast was the local species native to the land and suited to the climate which floated in and landed on the grain. It was thousands of years before brewers and bakers began to isolate and keep their varieties of yeast to brew and bake with. The yeast is IN THE AIR we breathe. It is all around you even now. You don't HAVE to hunt it down, just open a window. :wink:

 

[sw0snuff3r]

An excellent read jmatt, thanks for this! You other guys are making me want to dust off my old home brewing equipment.

 

[samon]

Really cool, thanks a bunch for the post! great replies too guys.
I'll forward this to my brother, he has a PHD in genetics, I'm sure he knows a load about bacterial yeast etc and maybe get a few blooms under the scope for a closer look and possibley test for sugars and other possible crystal type residue?
He is also a hardcore homebrew nerd!
Best of both, but not a botanist sadly, not that he can't just fill his brain in a few hours as an exercise in showing his little bro the ropes.

 

[jorgesoler]

This explains why a tin tastes better after a week or so

 

[cigrmaster]

Great thread guys, really interesting stuff.

 

[seacaptain]

Great thread, glad you bumped it.

 

[derekflint]

Good read !!

 

[npod]

Yes. Very good post.

 

[balkisobrains]

Except, no updates! :puffpipe:

 

[jamban]

Very nice read. Thoroughly enjoyable indeed. Thank you...
I love aging things and experiencing them as they age. The journey is awe-inspiring. I was exposed to aging through Chinese tea, and have applied the principles to various other teas and herbs. The fact that pipe tobacco ages well is the reason i was curious enough to try and am here today typing this.