Lane Closing in US--Should I Worry?

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peregrinus

Member
Aug 4, 2019
249
211
Seattle
As an historical observation I, and perhaps some other “older” members, remember that 25 years ago the same concerns regarding future tobacco availability and government regulations were passionate topics on the old alt.smokerspipes newsgroup.
For many, these concerns were the genesis of the idea of “cellaring” tobacco’s. This as insurance against an uncertain future and an impending tobacco apocalypse... which has yet to materialize.
An unforeseen consequence was that there are now those that have dozens of tins of 20 year old tobaccos to worry about.
 
Apr 11, 2018
156
29
And where is that right listed? Pursuit of happiness comes with the caveat emptor if not interfering with the same pursuit of others.
The two position during the ratification debates were that rights didn’t need to be listed since the only powers of the federal government were enumerated. The other side said that some crucial rights needed to be listed as an extra check on the government. That’s why the bill of right followed soon after. So just because a right is not listed doesn’t mean it doesn’t exist since they are self evident and “God given.”
 
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chasingembers

Preferred Member
Nov 12, 2014
16,730
2,204
The two position during the ratification debates were that rights didn’t need to be listed since the only powers of the federal government were enumerated. The other side said that some crucial rights needed to be listed as an extra check on the government. That’s why the bill of right followed soon after. So just because a right is not listed doesn’t mean it doesn’t exist since they are self evident and “God given.”
That was nearly 250 years ago. Self evident (obvious) is hard for most to comprehend anymore and any written right or law can be amended by popular vote. Smoking isn't very popular anymore and is considered a harmful substance. A "right" to smoke in the majority of today's population would go over as well as the right to cut off your own hand.
 
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Casual

Member
Oct 3, 2019
190
317
NL, CA
As an historical observation I, and perhaps some other “older” members, remember that 25 years ago the same concerns regarding future tobacco availability and government regulations were passionate topics on the old alt.smokerspipes newsgroup.
A cellar is just an insurance policy. Humans are terrible at evaluating the probability and value of very uncertain events, which means insurance companies can make a lot of bank.

Likewise, evaluating the probability that the tobacco supply will be interrupted by anything, legal or otherwise, is a hard problem. We’ve got little other than hunches.

At least a cellar is not a term life policy, where you pay the premiums, but might get nothing at the end. It’s more like a whole life policy. If nothing bad happens, you still have the tobacco.
 
Apr 11, 2018
156
29
That was nearly 250 years ago. Self evident (obvious) is hard for most to comprehend anymore and any written right or law can be amended by popular vote. Smoking isn't very popular anymore and is considered a harmful substance. A "right" to smoke in the majority of today's population would go over as well as the right to cut off your own hand.
I take your point that they stopped following the constitution almost immediately and it won’t prevent them from doing whatever it is that they want to do.
 

brian64

Preferred Member
Jan 31, 2011
5,432
536
The two position during the ratification debates were that rights didn’t need to be listed since the only powers of the federal government were enumerated. The other side said that some crucial rights needed to be listed as an extra check on the government. That’s why the bill of right followed soon after. So just because a right is not listed doesn’t mean it doesn’t exist since they are self evident and “God given.”
True, these disagreements were there from the start...which is why the Constitutional language defining the limits of federal powers is rather vague or overly broad in some places.

It had to be amended 10 times right off the bat, which could be argued is not really a good sign. And as I commented earlier, the 9th and 10th amendments are probably the most important, but they are also the most ignored.

We probably would have been better off sticking with the original articles of confederation.
 
Apr 11, 2018
156
29
True, these disagreements were there from the start...which is why the Constitutional language defining the limits of federal powers is rather vague or overly broad in some places.

It had to be amended 10 times right off the bat, which could be argued is not really a good sign. And as I commented earlier, the 9th and 10th amendments are probably the most important, but they are also the most ignored.

We probably would have been better off sticking with the original articles of confederation.
Agreed about the articles of confederation. I was going to list the enumerated powers but I won’t clutter up the thread.

The 10th amendment couldn’t be more clear, and yet Scalia said no one really knows what it means. You have to willfully ignore it, even from a textualist perspective, to give the federal government more power than what is enumerated.
 

condorlover1

Preferred Member
Dec 22, 2013
3,683
436
New York
Thats why after 25 years in the U.S I am going back to the U.K to live in post-Brexit Britain - its getting just a little bit too crazy over here for me! In the last few years I can feel the overreaching arm of the State everywhere and with every passing year it feels just a little more oppressive. Sadly 9-11 gave the power crazies every excuse they needed and whilst we beat the terrorists on the battlefield they have won. The guiding concept behind terror is not to destroy but to provoke an over reaction in the subject of that terror. Cheap, very efficient and reduces the population to misery as they are afflicted with ever more oppressive governance in the name of protecting freedom. The war on tobacco is just another example of things that slip in via the bureaucrats inherent need to tidy thing up - anyone remember 'Cigars for The Troops' getting tubed by some socially woke busy body?
 

condorlover1

Preferred Member
Dec 22, 2013
3,683
436
New York
I have wanted to retire for a while now and I guess being from the U.K I want to spend time with my remaining friends there since so many of them have fallen off the perch over the last few years. I am quietly thinking about it and yes brian64 I too share your views on Brexit. Just to cheer everyone up here is the German view of Brexit -
 
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snagstangl

Preferred Member
Jul 1, 2013
1,176
27
Condorlover, be honest, you are moving back to the UK so you can scour every mom & pop place and news stand for old production Condor.
 
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condorlover1

Preferred Member
Dec 22, 2013
3,683
436
New York
Good point Vapes! Actually if Lane of Georgia closes there may be a 1Q world shortage and that would be something to behold. If you look at Lanes parents balance sheet this whole tobacco FDA thing has really put a dent in their operations.
 

Casual

Member
Oct 3, 2019
190
317
NL, CA
Will this also affect Peter Stokkebye and Captain Black availability?
It sounds like they don’t expect any availability problems at all. They had excess production capacity, and they’re closing the Lane facility to consolidate production expenses.

We’ll see if that’s how it works out, but it doesn’t sound too tricky to accomplish. The Lane production wasn’t using hundred year old equipment that only a handful of people knew how to use, was it?