For a change, a positive article on our hobby.

[chromearty]

34 year old blue collar guy here. I tend to despise my millennial generation... and especially the hipsters there within. The fact that hipsters have taken to pipes is rather irritating, I have to hide my pipe smoking in fear of being labeled one!
No, pipes shouldn't just be for old men... but ugh, these gad damn hipsters!! Blegh

 

[warren]

And it is not a position that most people have arrived at by their own reasoning...but rather a position that they have been instructed to take by mass media/government programming...as are most other non-reality-based perceptions that the masses are given regarding any number of issues.

Is this not how the majority of people arrive at their opinions? Whether they be pro or anti-tobacco? People tend to read/watch only the information available that supports their beliefs. You and I are targeted by various companies/researchers/producers etc. who feed our biases. It's the way things have always been. Nothing new in this, only the media used has changed. Paine used broadsides, Attila used word of mouth, politicians have used rallies throughout history, Truman used the train, Eisenhower used TV, only the media changes. Very few people are open minded after their teens. Various organizations know their base and cater to it. And, that is why the youngsters are targeted by various organizations, to grow the base. Adults, by and large cling tenaciously to the beliefs put into their minds as children, striving to reinforce them.
Smokers, as a group (my opinion only), tend to be insecure in their choice and are always looking for support, be it fellow smokers, research, etc. When you are uncertain in your lifestyle choice, the slings and arrows hurt more. We are always looking for support, any support, from any source. Being part of a targeted minority can be hard if one isn't secure in their choices. Hence the need to demean the opposition.

 

[timt]

Smokers, as a group (my opinion only), tend to be insecure in their choice and are always looking for support, be it fellow smokers, research, etc. When you are uncertain in your lifestyle choice, the slings and arrows hurt more. We are always looking for support, any support, from any source. Being part of a targeted minority can be hard if one isn't secure in their choices. Hence the need to demean the opposition.

You're not saying the "slings and arrows" are merely harmless opinions are you? The opposition is seeking to end our activities entirely. I can handle anyone's opinion, if that's all it is. No insecurities there.

 

[briarbuck]

Have to agree with the article. I was out the other evening and had multiple "kids" (20 somethings) come up and say how cool my pipe was.

 

[brian64]

Is this not how the majority of people arrive at their opinions?

Yes, unfortunately...which is what I said.

Adults, by and large cling tenaciously to the beliefs put into their minds as children, striving to reinforce them.

Very true...which again, is essentially what I said.

We are always looking for support, any support, from any source.

I'm not looking for any support at all...I just want to be left the hell alone when it comes to choices that affect no one but myself.
Now I can't help but anticipate some inane comment about "second-hand smoke". My informed opinion is that it's mostly bullshit propaganda...but nevertheless, in my case, no one is EVER exposed to second hand smoke from me who does not wish to be.
And as far as "third-hand smoke", anyone who propagates or believes that BS to be any kind of genuine issue as something that justifies restricting or prohibiting tobacco use by an adult, is either a liar or just plain stupid.
IMO.

The opposition is seeking to end our activities entirely. I can handle anyone's opinion, if that's all it is. No insecurities there.

Exactly.

 

[olkofri]

Brian, you have to stop reading my mind and posting my thoughts! 8O
:wink:

 

[warren]

It's easy to justify restricting or prohibit tobacco without being either "stupid" or a "liar." Failure to understand the so-called enemy is exactly how we've arrived at this point in time with respect to tobacco use. The people leading the antis are well informed, educated and equipped to wage a societal war against tobacco. We smokers haven't a proverbial leg to stand on in this particular confrontation. All we have is "I like smoking." That, is not sufficient ammunition.

it comes to choices that affect no one but myself.

You can make that your mantra but, people ain't gonna buy into it. Simply purchasing tobacco, supporting the industry as it were, is anathema to the anti-tobacco crowd. If the product is available for the general public, it's a bad thing to many. The "drys" were beaten by the numerical superiority of the "wets" and "no opinions". Smokers are the minority in this case and your ability to purchase tobacco is an affront to the "antis". The "we don't cares" ... well they have no interest in your or my plight.
It's no fun being insignificant and that is what we are. Our enjoyment of tobacco simply drives the antis nuts. The antis have the support of society in general as it is simply an unsupportable, selfish vice with absolutely nothing positive going for it.

I can handle anyone's opinion, if that's all it is.

Those opinions are what drive the opponents of tobacco use. So, you are going to have to do more than "handle". You're going to have to acquiesce at some point and live with them should they eventually prevail and eventually ban tobacco use in all forms.

 

[hawky454]

:rofl:

Austin stopped being part of Texas a long time ago and fortunately there are only a couple of places in Texas like Austin - San Antonio, Houston & possibly Dallas. The rest of Texas is relatively sane.

That’s true. My parents own a nice place up in Salado, so I go up there often to get away from the wack jobs here. Unfortunately, there is a lot more job opportunities in Austin so I’ll have to stick around until I retire.

Maybe you should consider relocating to TX. I've heard it's a bit more sane there.

 

[brian64]

Brian, you have to stop reading my mind and posting my thoughts!

I was wondering whose voice that was I keep hearing in my head. The Canadian accent should have given it away. :mrgreen:

 

[georged]

Those opinions are what drive the opponents of [fill in the blank] use. So, you are going to have to do more than "handle". You're going to have to acquiesce at some point and live with them should they eventually prevail and eventually ban [fill in the blank] in all forms.

Because of social media & Net-related user tracking info acquisition, the "First they came for..." scenario will be the New Normal all too soon. The infamous historical instances of it so far will only be small, proof-of-concept exercises in comparison.

 

[brian64]

It's easy to justify restricting or prohibit tobacco without being either "stupid" or a "liar."

If one were to "parse" my comments carefully, they would see that the "liar or stupid" was referring specifically to the "3rd hand smoke issue".

Because of social media & Net-related user tracking info acquisition, the "First they came for..." scenario will be the New Normal all too soon. The infamous historical instances of it so far will only be small, proof-of-concept exercises in comparison.

You got that right. The army of morons is just getting warmed up.
Ultimately they'll be coming for anyone who exhales CO2.

 

[timt]

Suddenly, I feel the need to start hoarding bacon.

 

[brian64]

 

[warren]

That's as I took it and how I responded to it. They may be intolerant but, they are most likely neither stupid nor a liar. But, the politics of the day seem to make such responses acceptable, though they certainly do not further anyone's argument.

 

[timt]

Warren, you tickle me. Of course many of our opponents are stupid and dishonest. Or more accurately, they think everyone else is stupid, which isn't too bright if you ask me. Arrogant but not bright. I think Brian made a fine argument, using milder terms than I'd like to.
Anyway...time for a bowl.

 

[warren]

I prefer the well reasoned argument, without the politics of personality. Especially when the response(s) are simply railing against the "establishment", "big whomever", "them" and what not, as it is simply preaching to the choir. But, that's just me.
There is, to me anyway, a big difference between disparaging the "other side" and offering up well reasoned responses to their arguments. Disparaging easy targets takes no thought, usually only a simple jerk of the knee. A reasoned response takes thought and maybe even some research.
But, I gleefully enter into the fray as it is entertaining and helps me pass the time on rainy days. And, I thoroughly enjoy the train wrecks which sometimes result. I hate to miss a train wreck as some of the mods are very witty when they shut a thread down.
And, providing a bit of amusement is, of course, why I sometimes take a tack which is quite different from my firmly held beliefs.

 

[olkofri]

Heh, even the sympathetic mass media is excluded from the high-profile anti-tobacco discussions and policy-making conferences:
Journalists kicked out of the UN COP

 

[warren]

I consider the UN to be irrelevant in the grand scheme of things. Well, except for the third world countries and their representatives earning the large salaries while constantly poking the elephant.
Blaming "big gov", "big tobacco", and "big media" does nothing to refute the science integral to the anti-tobacco argument. The fact is, we smokers have nothing to fight back with. We never have and, most likely, never will. Instead we will have to rely on those same folks to allow tobacco use to be legal in some shape or form. Unless some scientist or medical researcher, probably working for "big tobacco" or "big government" or "big pharma, finds a something efficacious about smoking we are going to continue to be allowed to smoked only at the sufferance of the "antis."

 

[georged]

Only called the EU so far, its global equivalent---the UN---is the fondest hope of those who believe (in the religious sense) that such centralized control is the only workable future of Man on Earth.
My take, free of delusional silliness and knowing how humans actually work? 2A

 

[condorlover1]

:rofl: there is a reason why I love your posts @georged