Briar Pipes and Water

[davet]

Keep in mind that I'm exposing the briar to water for about 30 to 40 seconds. So a true test would be of about that duration.

Where would the fun be in that? :nana: What got me thinking of this was in the other thread, talk of wooden ships and such. How much time would saturate the briar? Would it split from soaking? Drying? I know it isn't a good comparison to a rinse with water.

Submerging the pipe for an extended time is not a fair comparison to flushing the bowl for less than a minute

See above;

I'm not saying rinsing your pipes is a comparison

This is all in fun, too many pipes, too much time and stupid ideas. (Mine)

 

[pappymac]

Let's also remember that you are not soaking "bare" briar but briar that has previously been aged and cured as well as finished with some form of stain which may also provide some waterproofing. Additionally, it may have been waxed at one time or have some glossy finish applied to it which may also provide some waterproofing.
You indicated that it is NOS (presumably New Old Stock) but it has been smoked 10 or 12 times. Throughout history people have been placing wooden stakes into fire to harden the sharp points. This also would tend to make the wood less likely to absorb water. I would guess that burning enough tobacco in the bowl would not only form a layer of carbon cake but the heat would harden the briar inside the bowl.
In my opinion, soaking the pipe in wood for 24 hours or so, isn't going to harm the briar. I also know a few pipe restorers who will take extremely hard used pipes and soak them in alcohol for 24 hours to remove finish, stain and cake and they are very successful in their business.

 

[davet]

All good points. I'm thinking on soaking it for a week or two , there'll be no denying it will have a good chance to soak up some water.

 

[sablebrush52]

Jesse, do you rinse all your pipes, regardless of value?

There are a few that have been specially treated with a silicate coating due to their age that I don't rinse with water. The rest, yes. I don't rinse the vulcanite stems with warm water. Those get alcohol. The acrylic stems get the warm water treatment, not alcohol. There are also a few pipes whose dimensional stability is more variable and these I don't give the water treatment as often, as they require more time to return to their proper fit.

 

[craiginthecorn]

Davet, I applaud your willingness to actually put assumptions to the test. My guess is that you’ll learn from it, as will the rest of us. I further expect that you’ll want to repeat the test with more specific goals in mind. The suggestion for a scale with greater precision is a good one. But the horse is already out of the barn on this test. Maybe next time. There will still be valuable observations from this test.
Pappymac, I have soaked entire stummels in alcohol and in fact, have done so under vacuum in an effort to draw the alcohol into the briar to rid it of pernicious mildew flavors. The finish, of course, suffered, but once dried thoroughly, the stem fit just fine and there seemed to be no ill effects. The lone exception was the stummel that was soaked under vacuum. I had to sand that pipe as it had the effect of raising some of the grain. Once sanded and refinished, though, all was fine.

 

[craiginthecorn]

There are few that have been specially treated with a silicate coating due to their age...

I’ve seen your references to these coatings in the past, Jesse. Could you please enlighten me about these coatings? Are they a modern coating, or historical? Were these coatings original to the pipes, or applied more recently as a protective measure? Are they a bowl coating, or a finish?

 

[mso489]

Stummels are submerged and/or rinsed in water in the process of carving, not to mention in the curing of the briar before that. I'd be a little leery about prolonged soaking, because it might cause the wood to expand and contract in soaking and drying. This is an interesting experiment, but as a scientific trial. For cleaning, a little running water is okay. Worked on my one estate Meer too, just fine with no ill effects.

 

[davet]

I'd be a little leery about prolonged soaking, because it might cause the wood to expand and contract in soaking and drying.

That's the whole point :mrgreen: A long soak and a long careful drying, should be interesting if nothing else.
I was curious about Meers and water though....

 

[craiginthecorn]

I have read more than one comment recently that stummels are submerged in water in the process of carving. I submit this is not true. Perhaps I'm misinterpreting the comments. My position is that the briar is boiled to remove saps, then dried for extended periods, even years, before carving. I am unaware of any carver that uses water in the process of carving or finishing except while initially examining and cutting the briar to expose the grain, and that's just a tiny amount that evaporates in minutes and likely removed from the finished product in the process of shaping. Not that I'm an expert, by any means, but I did take the two-day pipe carving and finishing class at last year's Chicago Pipe Show. It was taught by no less than Jeff Gracik, Lee Erck, Ernie Markle, Andy Peterson, and assisted by Rex Poggenpohl. Not a drop of water was in use.
This is not to say that water is inherently harmful to the briar. Several respected members of this forum have endorsed water rinses. It's time for all to consider the real possibility that it's in fact a good idea. I've done so myself on occasion with no problems apart from some dulling of the wax finish, which is easily remedied. In the end, I have chosen to fastidiously clean my pipes immediately after smoking with a simple pipe cleaner and to date, that's been effective for me. However, I have enough pipes that I do not smoke each one all that frequently and generally only smoke tobaccos which tend to leave little residue in my pipes.

 

[davet]

Four or five hours in and the water has darkened but what is interesting, to me, is the rim and sides are covered in very small bubbles. The result of absorbing water expels air?

 

[jpmcwjr]

That should make a delicious tea when done. Er, to be sure, I jest....
Wetting the surface of wood is a time honored practice among woodworkers, cabinet makers and such. It raises the grain and when dry again, is sanded to a smooth finish. May be repeated several times with higher numbered grit paper.
However, if no water was present nor mentioned in the workshop, it must not raise the grain with briar wood, or if it does, not necessary, as there are few if any flat surfaces, and what there are are small. And for most carvers much sanding is at least partly mechanized.

 

[pitchfork]

A quick rinse is one thing, but the surface of a smooth pipe can become somewhat uneven over an extended period of time. For instance I know someone who left some pipes out in the rain for a couple of days and the surface was slightly grooved where there was straight or flame grain and slightly pock-marked where there was birdseye/crossgrain.

 

[jpmcwjr]

Any chance those same pipes got dried out in the sun after the rain?

 

[ashdigger]

For the sake of "science". I'm running a parallel experiment. A briar, weighed to the gram and water. Mine is a large billiard that was sandblasted. I'll post pictures here along with details.

 

[haparnold]

Let's get everyone to do it! I volunteer to run regressions on our data :P

 

[mikethompson]

Dave you need to set up a webcam so we can watch this in real time!
(I'm only half kidding, I think)

 

[ashdigger]

This was started at 6:00 pm (PST) on 1-23-19. The briar weighs 35 grams. It is floating in 16 ounces of purified water.

 

[mikethompson]

 

[davet]

A quick rinse is one thing, but the surface of a smooth pipe can become somewhat uneven over an extended period of time.

I'll guess we'll find out :mrgreen: We just might learn sumthin here 8O
+ A parallel experiment as well :clap:

 

[davet]

Dave you need to set up a webcam so we can watch this in real time!

Trust me.... you don't want a webcam in this house 8O