A Message From Mike & Mary McNiel
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This year's Red Virginia situation is starting to feel like last year's Syrian situation.
Bummer.
On a happy note, I have enough of both.
Bummer.
On a happy note, I have enough of both.
Sable, that's my thoughts exactly. I'm fortunate to be stocked up. This is just fodder for speculation, rumination and exasperation.
At the risk of fanning the flames of conjecture: This means that there is no acceptable product on the market to the McNiels standard, therefore every other blender currently selling a tobacco with red VA is producing a inferior blend. Interesting. :?
I feel for you guys, but have personally no fond relationship with McClellend's VA's. Like cigrmaster, they hate my tongue.
Kind of like beef. A certain cut will still make my tacos turn out well, but may leave your Wellington dish not great.
As laypersons in the art of blending, I doubt we see the whole big picture. It may be that the VA's they are now finding will not produce the taste outcome they seek, but will still create the desired outcome of another producer. As their processing is unique to themselves, we don't know what form of voodoo they doo...
Kind of like beef. A certain cut will still make my tacos turn out well, but may leave your Wellington dish not great.
Looking at my carpet, there seems to be a vacuum lacking here... :nana:
(Sorry- I'm loopy on a giant bowl of Brown Irish X right now!)
(Sorry- I'm loopy on a giant bowl of Brown Irish X right now!)
Sad to hear the news about the ending of these Red Virginia - a signature of many McClelland blends.
To combine with the other thread also about Red Virginia (ed Virginia Shortage Affecting McCranie’s Too), it seems that Virginia leaves farmers are no longer:
But we need to know what is the procedure and conditions of these flue-cured process, so that Red Virginia can still be reproduced by enthusiasts in the future.
Otherwise, I will miss the ketchup tin smell forever until the day I have to rest.
To combine with the other thread also about Red Virginia (ed Virginia Shortage Affecting McCranie’s Too), it seems that Virginia leaves farmers are no longer:
If it is because the process method being not profitable, there can still be ways to have them produced in the future perhaps in smaller batches and by these organic independent farmers - there are more and more people growing their own tobacco leaves. As long as there is a pipe, there is a way.
But we need to know what is the procedure and conditions of these flue-cured process, so that Red Virginia can still be reproduced by enthusiasts in the future.
Otherwise, I will miss the ketchup tin smell forever until the day I have to rest.
Any way it happens, there must be a profit sufficient to warrant the effort. Woodsroad may have been right about cigarette manufacturers driving what gets made and what doesn't. Small batch boutique manufacturers aren't likely to produce product at a lesser price point. BTW, the ketchup isn't because of the flue curing.
That's the rub, Menuhin. It will take a stoked and resourceful individual to find/convince those farmers to produce such leaf, bear the expense of growing/harvesting/pulling/curing it - at quite a risk, unless someone wants to put up the $'s for such a project. It IS possible, but then it has to be processed with the skill and love of someone like Mike McNiel - and there aren't many people in this world with the audacity, love and stamina to do so, God bless him/her!
From a few posts up, it seems there in the current system of Tobacco leaves trade / auctioning, there is no such a chance for the farmers to change the price to produce flue-cured in such an old and beloved way.
@sablebrush52
Oh right, you reminded me of one or two in-depth threads that discussed the ketchup smell a few years back. That tin smell is, however, what I also have associated with McClelland's Red Virginia taste in my pipe.
I'm pretty bummed out about this news. Living in Hungary it was hard enough so far to get any McClelland blends and I've never tried 5100 red cake. As a virginia lover I would've loved to but I guess I need to forget it...
IMHO, this has been going on for quite sometime. I was fortunate enough to be able to attend the last true tobacco auction in Wilson NC some years ago. Must have been at least twelve to fifteen years ago. Even at that point, the farmers, and buyers, were talking about how drastically the industry would change. Since then, the farmers have changed how they do business. Not so much by choice, but more of an economic decision.
Part of the blame can be attributed to the Federal Government. They came in and have done everything possible to get the farmers to quit growing tobacco. They offered subsidies to farmers in order to get them to abandon tobacco for soybean, corn, etc.
Another part of the issue is the way farming has changed. I have talked to a number of farmers who grow tobacco, and many of them have said that tobacco paid for their kids college. The problem is that many of those kids do not want to be farmers and do not come back home to take over the family business. So I have a feeling that many of the tobacco farmers are the last of the line and once they retire, their farms will be sold and bye bye tobacco, hello condos.
A big part of the problem began when the auctions ended. Now farmers sell their crop direct with a pre set price. It really doesn't matter how "top of the line" their crop is. The majority will go to cigarettes and with all of the chemical enhancement that is done to them, it really doesn't matter about the tobacco itself. Growing tobacco is a labor of love effort. It is very time consuming when growing a particular type of leaf, but if your just growing a standard, run of the mill, leaf for Phillip Morris, it is much less time consuming. From a growers perspective, it makes economic sense to grow something that requires less time and effort.
I think that many of the blenders saw this coming and probably stocked up on as much quality tobacco while they could. But as time goes on, those stock piles will run out. Then the blender will have to make some hard decisions, I think that we are seeing one of those hard decisions now with 5100 and I am sure that we will see more of our favorite blends being discontinued as time goes on.
In my opinion, and it's only an opinion so take it for what it's worth, we have spent so much time fighting the anti-tobacco legislation, gaining a small victory here and there, but we failed to take a look at the bigger picture. The source. As it has been said a few times in this thread, pull out you credit card and buy, buy, buy. That's not a "sky is falling" statement, that is being said based on what has been happening for well over a decade plus in the industry.
Part of the blame can be attributed to the Federal Government. They came in and have done everything possible to get the farmers to quit growing tobacco. They offered subsidies to farmers in order to get them to abandon tobacco for soybean, corn, etc.
Another part of the issue is the way farming has changed. I have talked to a number of farmers who grow tobacco, and many of them have said that tobacco paid for their kids college. The problem is that many of those kids do not want to be farmers and do not come back home to take over the family business. So I have a feeling that many of the tobacco farmers are the last of the line and once they retire, their farms will be sold and bye bye tobacco, hello condos.
A big part of the problem began when the auctions ended. Now farmers sell their crop direct with a pre set price. It really doesn't matter how "top of the line" their crop is. The majority will go to cigarettes and with all of the chemical enhancement that is done to them, it really doesn't matter about the tobacco itself. Growing tobacco is a labor of love effort. It is very time consuming when growing a particular type of leaf, but if your just growing a standard, run of the mill, leaf for Phillip Morris, it is much less time consuming. From a growers perspective, it makes economic sense to grow something that requires less time and effort.
I think that many of the blenders saw this coming and probably stocked up on as much quality tobacco while they could. But as time goes on, those stock piles will run out. Then the blender will have to make some hard decisions, I think that we are seeing one of those hard decisions now with 5100 and I am sure that we will see more of our favorite blends being discontinued as time goes on.
In my opinion, and it's only an opinion so take it for what it's worth, we have spent so much time fighting the anti-tobacco legislation, gaining a small victory here and there, but we failed to take a look at the bigger picture. The source. As it has been said a few times in this thread, pull out you credit card and buy, buy, buy. That's not a "sky is falling" statement, that is being said based on what has been happening for well over a decade plus in the industry.
Disturbing...
Sounds like the reason right there. If any red Virginia is as good as any other, why bother?
There might be a need for a farm-to-market pipeline for pipe smoking tobacco. Or a co-op.
Could be the cost. If a company is asking a farmer to grow something unique, it will be more time consuming and end up costing more to produce. That cost would be passed on to the consumer. How much is a person willing to pay for a tin of their favorite tobacco blend and would the company be able to sell enough to show a profit?
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